Chronicle vs Forsaken GOAT flex debate

#1

Uncleben

Who’s y’all’s goat flex? I have to go chronicle, he’s just put up way more impressive international tournaments (lock-in, Tokyo, champs 24, Toronto, Berlin, Berlin champs, EWC) compared to forsaken (Toronto, Copenhagen, champs 23). People criticize chronicle for only performing on super teams but despite prx’s individual success forsaken hasn’t really had many dominant tournaments globally.

Comparing their flex ability, chronicle is a better initiator and sentinel, while forsaken is a better smokes and duelist.

#2

gamergirl

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forsaken is better at flex chronicle is better at valorant

#4

Uncleben

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Why so? Chronicle plays a huge amount of agents really well too.

#8

gamergirl

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chronicle has >20 maps played on 7 agents, f0rsaken on 13 agents - longer history on different agents

f0rsaken plays all four roles consistently, and has always been like this, chroncile historically on fnc was a breach raze viper player, and has picked up senti after alfa himself started flexing,

he still is really only senti/flash while f0rsaken has played init controller duelist recently

#11

Uncleben

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Forsaken rarely plays duelist anymore, so if you include that then you have to include chronicle also playing recon initiator
Chronicle played initiator and duelist on gambit, initiator (scan after Leo left and flash) + viper, and now plays 3 roles (sentinel, viper, flash initiator). Just playing more agents doesn’t make you a better flex, chronicle is better than forsaken on most initiator and sentinel agents.

#13

gamergirl

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viper plays like a sentinel

either way f0rsaken plays more agents at a higher level, idk why this is a discussion,

the gap has definitely closed from before but theres still a gap

chronicle is good at what he plays but f0rsaken plays everything

#15

Uncleben

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Which agents does forsaken play at a higher level than chron?
I think chron is a better viper, kay0, vyse, kj, cypher, sova, breach, skye than forsaken. I think forsaken is a better Jett, omen, astra, chamber, fade, neon, and yoru than chron (obv chronicle don’t really play neon or yoru). Raze is an interesting question because neither have many games on her.

#17

mongu

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hmmmmmmm

#25

sentinelmain377

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f0rsaken is not a better chamber lmaoooooooooo

what am i reading bro

#27

Uncleben

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I don’t recall chron being a particularly good chamber? Maybe I’m misremembering but I always thought nats was gambits best chamber. Forsaken had some nice performance in chamber at Copenhagen tho

#33

sentinelmain377

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f0rsaken plays a few more agents

but the ones Chronicle plays are at a way higher level. making Chronicle a better flex.

#40

gamergirl

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well i think chronicle is better at valorant but i just think f0rsaken can actually look decent on any agent, not just any role

cant really put chronicle on neon can ya

#44

sentinelmain377

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neon and yoru are just niche characters.

#41

goat1594

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He's played duelist 2 times this split already

#43

gamergirl

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theyre just throating chronicle who anyone knows is a better player when we can literally see in an objective matter that f0rsaken has no weakness on his agent pool while chronicle does

#3

KiwiJuice

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Forsaken is better individually, chronicle won more trophies. That's it

#5

Uncleben

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I disagree. Why do you think forsaken is better individually? Chronicle has had way more impressive international tournaments than forsaken.

#9

TheOnion

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He’s crazy

#10

KiwiJuice

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Forsaken would smack him in a 1v1 is what im saying.

#12

Uncleben

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1v1s don’t really matter in a 5v5 game, realistically some random radiants could beat a pro player in a 1v1

#30

sentinelmain377

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u havent seen his stats lmao

Chronicle's international stats clear f0rsaken by a lot
f0rsaken has average or below average stats (other than Toronto)

#14

serot

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stat farmer
amount of impact forsaken had vs chronicle is not even close when you look at toronto

#16

Uncleben

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Forsaken was definitely better than chronicle at Toronto and champs 23. Chronicle was better in Berlin, champs 21, better in lock-in, better at Tokyo, better at champs 24.

#31

sentinelmain377

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Chron has been better in way more events. looks like i gotta bring this back up:::

Chronicle:
Trophies: 3, Finals: 5, Top 4s: 6, Top 6s: 7, Top 8s: 8
International Appearances: 8/14

Best performances (general objective opinion of everyone):
Berlin 2021: 2nd MVP (VERY VERY closely after nAts)
Champs 2021: real MVP of the tournament statistically (but on runner-up team)
Toronto 2025: 2nd MVP on runner-ups (3rd/4th MVP of the tournament overall)
Riyadh 2025: real MVP of the tournament statistically (but on runner-up team)

International Ratings:
1.26(#3), 1.19(#4), 1.10(#14 min. 125 rounds LOCK//IN), 1.19(#3), 0.94(#53), N/A(China), 1.21(#4), 1.13 (#8), 1.30 (#1)
6 Tournaments of being a minimum top 8 rated player.

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F0rsaken:
Trophies: 1, Finals: 3, Top 4s: 6, Top 6s: 7, Top 8s: 7
International Appearances: 11/14

Best performances:
Toronto 2025: MVP of Toronto 2025's winning team (realistic: 2nd MVP)

International Ratings:
0.93 (#45), 1.12 (#12), 0.98 (#35), 0.91 (#57), N/A (min. 125 rounds LOCK//IN), 0.96 (#39), 1.01 (#33), 1.01 (#16), N/A(China), 0.95 (#49), 1.12 (#10), 1.16 (#15)
1 tournament of being a top 10 player.

#6

glittering_yard

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I only see this discussion here in vlr, at least in my region's community its almost a consensus that f0rsaken is the goat flex

#7

Uncleben

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I’d only agree if you value international and regional performances equally
However internationally there is a pretty big gap in favor of chronicle, but chron has been on historically better teams which is what makes the debate close

#20

glittering_yard

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but thats the thing, chronicle was never THE superstar of the team. In Gambit it was nAts, in Fnatic it was Leo, Alfajer, Derke... Even kaajak this year has been better than him

Im not talking about stats, im going purely from the eye test and i dont see how chronicle would be a better "flex" than f0rsaken. In Masters Toronto for example, chronicle played only sentinel.

F0rsaken played controller and initiator and was the MVP of the tournament, he also played all 4 roles this year and historically plays almost every agent of the game. f0rsaken has a way bigger agent pool and he has more impactful individual performances for the team, he was always THE superstar of his team, Chronicle just happened to play with multiple top 10 players of all time on his team

#21

Uncleben

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Eye test favors aggressive players, but getting 1kill 4 rounds in a row is better than 4 kills in 1 round. Also, forsaken majority played smokes in Toronto as well, only occasionally initiator.

The revisionist history NEEDS to stop. Forsaken is the best prx player because he’s the most consistent, but something, jinggg, and davai have 100% played better than forsaken at different tournaments throughout prx’s peaks (Tokyo, champs 23, pac league 23).

Also chronicle was as good as nats on gambit. Nats was better than him in Berlin and chronicle was better at champs. I’m not using trophies as an argument, looking at purely individual performance, Chron is just better internationally.

#22

xineFso

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F0rsaken’s impact to the rounds clears chronicle by miles

and bro said Something has played better lmfao

#24

Uncleben

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In pacific league 23, arguably at champs 23 as well. Davai played better at some of the regionals in 24 and at champs 23, jingg played better at masters Tokyo
Forsaken was his teams best player at tonronto and copenhagen, maybe at Madrid?

#26

laeDLaer

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of course you guys think that because chronicle was a part of the 3-11 xD

brazilian fans always discrediting the players and teams who fk them

#32

sentinelmain377

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disgusting amer/apac propaganda being spread in ur region's community lmaooooo.

ur region's community must be depressed after 3-11 and 5-12 from Chronicle

#18

luhuigarten

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there is no debate lol chronicle gaps hard

#19

xineFso

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in term of Flex no one is even debatable with Forsaken currently

#23

Elby56

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Chronicle, but if f0rsaken wins champs it might be f0rsaken.

As of right now though, Chronicle's achivements speak for themselves. You watch the FNC voice comms video, this guy is like secondary IGL while letting his teamates all play comfort cause he can play literally every agent.

#28

Gdgdfdgtttt

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people always say chronicle has always been on superteams and thats why he wins so much but thats a shit argument
theres a reason hes on all these superteams, its because hes good, 75% of the time better than forsaken at inters
also i always felt like people glaze forsaken just because of paper rex's playstyle and that they are likeable which is understandable
chronicle is better, trophies speak for themselves individual performances speak for themselves team sucess speaks for itself

#29

Uncleben

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Also, chronicle is a big reason why both fnc and gambit were considered super teams in the first place

I think pacific fans glaze forsaken, which they should, but NA fans as well since they have a rivalry with EU and don’t want to give credit. I think it’s a pretty close debate but if either of them is the undeniable flex goat its chronicle not forsaken.

#34

pepthefrog

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It's a toss-up, no one will ever know but you can all come up with your own conclusions though!

#35

sentinelmain377

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its Chron. but deluded PAC fans who need to hold onto one of their few good players will tell u f0rsaken even though Chronicle clears him by miles on most agents in every category except duelists (where Chron does have experience tho btw)

#36

jixk

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he doesnt clear him on smokes dont say viper she is a senti and plays like a senti on every map except half of icebox(defense) so they are 2 for 2 and dont even add chron's raze i promise f0rsaken's one map of pro raze clears and the other duelist picks arent close at all

#39

sentinelmain377

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Valorant success/GOAT: Chronicle >>>> f0rsaken no discussion needed.

Flex debate:
here is what i think on who's better at which agents:

Chron: Sova, Breach, KAY/O, Viper, Brimstone, Cypher, Killjoy, Sage, Vyse
F0rsaken: Fade, Skye, Omen, Harbor, Chamber, Jett, Phoenix, Raze, Yoru, Neon
Neither: Gekko, Tejo, Deadlock, Iso, Waylay
negligible: Reyna

Chron clears though. F0rsaken only has 1 more agent since there are just a lot of duelists to play.
both of them are flexible enough where the discussion shouldnt be about who is more flexible. Chron just has way better stats internationally than f0rsaken (like WAYYYYYYYYY better stats).

#42

jixk

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idk OP's intention so i will say both if OP's intention is flex ability f0rsaken gets it cause your rate a flex on agent count and agent mastery speed f0rsaken is better at both aspects if it is a GOAT flex debate like agent mastery-perfection for hypothetical team chron clears cause OP was unclear like most engagement bait threads about chron vs f0rsaken flex debate

if f0rsaken primary calls he surely clears on 2nd caller they aren't that different enough to be seperated when comparing a igl to a none igl but its a secondary role split so whatever tbh

on the agent split i fully agree but i feel like chamber is closer to f0rsaken then you put it as since when he picked up chamber he was prx's primary awp when he picked it up and that is chamber's sole factor but both of em were mid on him so meh

TLDR; f0rsaken has a stronger flex ability chron has better flex mastery OP was unclear on what matter more so on a solely flex perspective they are even slight advantage to f0rsaken cause he has a faster agent mastery rate in every other aspect of the game chron clears aside from as far as we know igl,primary smokes,entry

sentinel smokes

bro created a new role
you forgot astra and waylay(f0rsaken has the best waylay understanding so far) while chron clears on kayo its more debatable then you think cause suprisingly f0rsaken has more play time on him then chron
why do u keep deleting points i look like a schizo

#37

FineByMe

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GOAT flex- f0rsaken in my opinion

f0rsaken quickly gets how to play an agent and plays at the highest level. Even if you look at this year, he played flash initiator/sentinel during kickoff, then PRX realised Yoru is the meta but something wasnt comfortable on Yoru, so he had to play Yoru/Neon during Stage 1 (also played vyse coz Davai used to flash himself) and then switched to smokes when Patmen was subbed in. Played smokes/scan initiator during Toronto And then during stage 2, he plays Waylay (an agent that no other team has been able to use effectively)/ smokes/scan initiator. Whenever PRX needs some change in roles they know they can rely on f0rsaken because his agent pool is so vast. There was a LF/GF where he played a whole comp. I dont think any player does that at such high level. Most pros try different things and then settle to their niche, while f0rsaken plays whatever his team needs.

#38

jixk

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they are 2 for 2 on role comfort f0rsaken is better at flexing chron clears him every where else mechs and impact are debatable but end of the day chron is the goat of the game by a mile so debating the other aspects wont be much of a debate

if chron's flex were to be tested like f0rsaken's has would he be better probably but as far as we know f0rsaken has flexed harder and leveled up more agents to the Tier 1 level has a reached mastery on most of them chron has a slightly smaller agent pool that he has perfected since he is the goat of the game he doesn't needed it to be any bigger if he did he would easily catch up to f0rsaken probably

who is better it depends on what hypothetically team wants when picking them up igl/your team has fucked roles but the bums with 2-3 agents in there pool f0rsaken
you have any role stability at all and want to play the game normally chron

#45

Two_Percent

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aim: forsaken
agent pool: forsaken
results: chron
game sense: chron
util: chron
role flexibility: forsaken
consistency: forsaken (this is really close and debatable tho)
peak: forsaken
average: chron (again really close)

Overall just bc he has 3 trophies since 2021, and been on multiple good teams, I would lean chron, but forsaken is by no means far behind