crashies is the best initiator the game has ever seen after Leo.
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he's probably not the top 10 initiator ever.
But he's definitely one of the most improved players ever.
Not even in prime optic does he drop this kind of performance regularly
Holy I'm donwvotted just because I'm giving somewhat valid opinions.
GJ VLR
bro its not the job to go +20 every match ofc Leo did it often and many players do but crashies is always there when you need him and clutches so many important rounds his impact is just not replaceable in my opinion
that's why I said, he's the most improved. Bcs no one expects an unc from a deleted team, that just got transferred from a mid ass NA team (that year), could actually improve this crazy
find the old threads.
See how no one is saying he will help FNC get 3 intl gf in a row.
No one said that he can fill up the shoes that Leo left behind.
No one even said that he will be staying for this long.
It is hard to judge a player when the team as a whole plays bad, Like Texture, CrazyGuy etc
crashies is def Top 3 of all, Impact on multiple teams with crazy number of finals.
Nah, look at the facts. How can we ignore that Fnatic and OpTic were constantly in Grand Finals? He’s definitely doing something right, whether it's util or comms , to make up for the lack of frags.
Lost 5(?) finals where his individual performance left a lot to be desired
lmfao you hit one good flick and people start calling you top 1 vlr truly is reactionary central
ive always been a crashies fan and always thought hes way to overhated but okay
realistically top 5. i mean you still have ethan, riens, leo, trent etc
trent? No, ethan is valid but hes not only initiator anymore and riens only individual skill and like i said Leo ofc hes the best player to ever touch the game
trent has 3 domestic trophies and a second place tourney and has widely been considered a top 2 player on g2. ethan was playing mainly flash intiator for his two champs wins and his second place at tokyo. riens has two second places (champs and masters) and won ewc playing purely intiator. trent is on par with crashies if anything
trent shouldn’t even be in the same conversation as crashies, just 2021-22 crashies clears trent’s entire career
domestic trophies no one cares about and internationally crashies has achieved way way more than Trent has and ever will
the claim stated was that crashies is the best initiator after leo. sure crashies has achieved more than trent and i didn't claim he didn't. however, if we are talking about best you also have to consider the times in which crashies was seen as a bad initiator (nrg 2024). trent has been consistently a top 5 initiator in americas since he was on a team and it isn't absurd to claim that in terms of raw talent and the ability to be good, trent is more consistent than crashies (considering both crashies highs and lows).
Trent’s 2025 clears any year of crashies career. Stop comparing star players to supports
Even Trent’s 2022 clears crashies 2022. There isn’t a single point in Trent’s career where he could’ve afforded to be the 4th best player on his team and won an international like crashies did at Reykjavik
Leo won't always be one of the best considering he hasn't played in an official in almost two years and is retired while the others are still playing.
i would argue that ethan is easily the best initiator. leo (as of rn) is probably close second. crashies/trent interchangeable at the 3 and 4. and lastly sacy/riens interchangeable at the 5 and 6.
i would agree depending on what they mean by best. crashies ability to mid round i think is important but doesn't really add value to the "best initiator argument". i think he meant in terms of raw skill and i would say that trent is on par with crashies in terms of skill while riens has been a little lower as of recent.
idc bro just give him a lifetime contract and EU citizenship after that clutch
tr0nt verno over crashies okay brah
you can say brawk over crashies on recent form but all time crashies is above all of them
Due to what exactly... based on brawks time in tier 1 hes better. Crashies does nothing better than any of them beyond maybe team play with util compared to verno as he play a little more individual. And I think all 3 are better mechanically.
If we're talking about all time, I think hes definitely top 5, maybe even make a case for top 3
Edit: Actually no, hes not top 3 (Leo,ethan,sacy clear him)
Definitely not #1 but he is no doubt top 5 all time. Just look at all the old Optic players man. He is the only one to stay this good for this long
In terms of best initiators, obviously Leo is #1. I don't think Ethan counts anymore because he flexes, but his first champs win was when he was full initiator so he definitely still makes the list. Riens is really good but he has less trophies AND less finals than Crashies, plus Heretics in general look a little down lately. Trent was insane during Tejo meta but his stats fell big time shortly after, still top 5 though. Stax also definitely should be up there. Cloud has been amazing for a long time, just confined to the prison of mid teams forever. Brawk obviously blew up last year and got multiple maps changed with how hard he abused the Odin. Sacy is also an obvious shoe-in. The people saying Crashies is not even top 10 are delusional. I would love to see the list of people who have him out of the top 10.
why would ethan not count? out of the 7 maps in the map pool in champs 2025, ethan played an initiator on 5 of them. the only maps he didnt play an initiator on were abyss and haven where he played omen.
He’s a very consistent role player with a lot of history but I don’t think he’s even in the top 5 for best initiators right now.
Riens | Ethan | Brawk | Trent | Verno
HM: Crashies | Kushy | Invy | Patmen | slowly | Cloud
On that note, I am pretty excited to see Sayonara play on VIT.
current riens and trent doesnt even comes close crashies clears them both only current brawk comes close even then i would favor crashies slightly over him
There is always an IGL Debuff. Good IGLs just manage it a lot better after adapting and I’d venture to say that both of them would perform better individually if they weren’t on IGL duty (Johnqt is a great example). That’s what makes fragging IGLs so rare and impressive.
crashies > current RieNs & trent
prime RieNs & trent > crashies
overall consistency paired with skill
crashies > RieNs and trent
crashies >= Verno
Ethan > crashies
brawk >= crashies
crashies >>> Kushy, Invy, slowly, Cloud
crashies > PatMen
Don't ever put a clown like "slowly" or "Cloud" or "Kushy" in the same conversation as my boy crashies
You can totally value consistency over peak form and that’s okay. Besides cloud, those other two have had higher individual peaks than Crashies so it felt right to give them HMs.
Sorry, we're talking about the same person, right? Ethan? 100T Ethan? EG Ethan? NRG Ethan? The guy who carried a mediocre 100T roster Ethan in Berlin? The guy who helped salvage and IGL an above-average team to a legendary champions victory? The guy that pushed his team over the line in the Grand Finals versus FNATIC? The world's FIRST and ONLY TWO TIME champions victor Ethan? And Ethan is somehow nowhere near the level of crashies? crashies is a phenomenal player, and his skill level is close to Ethan's, but to say that crashies "clears" him is absurd
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