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optic 2022, consistent but tbh only has a trophy bc of politics
cant really name other teams, sorry, just optic today
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top 3 overrated teams
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FPX were pretty vividly the best team itw, and they had not been allowed to attend, however the next event they attended, they won won of the most competitive tournaments
gamergirl we need to stop baiting "most competitive tournaments" and copenhagen do not belong with each other. Also why do EMEA fans keep saying FPX would've won iceland when their only trophy comes from a tourney where loud bombed out and wasn't locked in.
The classic "If my favorite team was at said event they would have won". At the end of the day optc still won a masters event and made grand finals in champions. Your argument might have been slightly more credible if fpx won champs. But they didnt. They lost to DRX in the lowers and then DRX immediately lost to OPTC.
OPTC won fair and square, there's no guarantee that FPX would beat OPTC at Reykjavik.
Yall just wanna hype up copenhagen as being more competitive as if champs isnt a bigger and more competitive event.
FPX was stronger earlier in the year, regional contenders rarely stay the same all year, but it was clear that FPX peaked earlier than copenhagen via regional results and performance - and either way the best team of a region not attending will always be competively unsound
optic won fairly, but no matter how you felt there was a missing figure that DID win the next event,
copenhagen isnt more competitve than champs, not at all, but its certainly one of the most competitve events, and much more so than iceland 22
loud won champs 2022 and performed well, but they're overrated because it was with a relatively easy path. a good example of this is that they didn't had to face fpx or xset, and in the final they faced optic, who came in quite tired after having played an intense bo5 the day before, in addition to relying heavily on certain players at key moments. on the other hand, fnatic, for example, has been consistent for a long time, winning several major tournaments, adapting to changes in the meta, and showing much stronger and sustained dominance, which makes them a really good team that deserves all the praise. i say, then explain to me why most of the former loud 2022 members are on bad teams or have retired
sorry, so they destroyed drx, who fucked fpx, xset weren't ALL that but i see a point there.
Optic came in tired because LOUD 2-0d them 13-10, 13-3, so they kind of earned it, they relied on key players on key moments that have always been "clutch" players
You list fnatic, but fnatic struggled to beat LOUD 2022 (after losing their two best players) and then Fnatic got dominated by LOUD at champs that same year
so which is it, is LOUD overrated or Fnatic?
if loud 2023 kept sacy and pancada they would 3-0 fnatic on lock/in and come as good contender for masters tokyo as well
aspas>derke
saadhak=<chronicle
less>alfajer
pancada>>>boaster
sacy>=leo
this is valid but doesnt explain why they are overrated which is the overarching question.
U say fnc in 2023 was better and I dont think anybody would disagree.
how is fnc 2023 better than loud 2022 when they were worse than a downgraded LOUD roster?
I can understsand how you value longevity - but even early in the year they barely won, so how exactly is loud 2022 worse
loud 2022: 2nd, last, 1st
fnc 2023: 1st, 1st, 4th
tell me which is more impressive. Also fnc played in multiple metas whereas loud did that in just the same meta (chamber meta).
if we go just purely by players which is a very dumb way of doing it but I see people like you ranking teams by individual players fnc still comes out better.
Leo > sacy
boaster < panc
derke < aspas (2023 derke clears 2022 aspas tho).
alfa > less
chron > saadhak
meta in 2023 was pretty much the same, idk wym bra
also loud did it in the chamber meta - without a chamber
and you can say what you'd like but LOUD 2022 IS better than fnatic 2023, purely based of the fact that FNC 2023 is worse than a worse loud team
so because FNC at their worse was worse than loud at their worse then they are automatically a worse team???? what kinda logic is that.
also its just not true, loud in 2022 bombed out of copenhagen which is way worse than FNCs worst achievemnt in 2023 which was coming 4th at champs
a team that finished in top 3 every international for the year is overrated, sure
why do you reply with an acomplishment, as if they can't be over rated even with that in mind
I didn't say they suck
dude, i didn't even see anyone on this rate them let alone overrating them
top 1 overrated team:
- SEN 2021 (the 2025 amer/apac propaganda overrates them so much to validate TenZ as a top player lmaooooo)
top 3 underrated teams:
- ACEND 2021
- ENVY 2021/OPTIC 2022/NRG 2023
- fnatic 2021-2022
acend and fnatic are very underrated teams in that period
sen 2021 is properly rated, its literally just a streamer team nobody pays them much mind or thinks they are amazing - but they were def the best team itw at that time
optic is only overrated if you have them in top 5 teams of all time, if you dont you're good
envy21/optic22/nrg23 maybe nrg 23-25 is still a top 4 team all time wym?
btw envy/optic is the exact same team (roster). 2nd, 9th-12th, 1st, 3rd, 2nd, 5th-8th, 4th, 9th-12th is insane btw
you said optic 2022, and nah they aint top 4 all time
give me loud 22 fnc 23 gambit 21 prx 25 geng 24, you can even say that fpx 22 roster is one of the best ever
that optic (roster) lost to gambit, lost to loud, lost to fpx, lost to prx and only won bc of a war
ranking the core, they might be top 3 all time, but prx fnatic still above
ok i meant envy21/optic22/nrg23 (it was exact same or nearly the same roster for 3 years with the core of Crashies Vic FNS Chet always there)
Getting top 3 overall all 3 international events and winning one is NOT fraudulent
winning when FPX was the best team is fraudulent:
they admitted it themselves (Vic & Chet): https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bBOI6WjHVKM&t=2295s
people saying fpx not attending makes optic’s run fraudulent just because fpx so happened to win copenhagen is sheer cope
this same roster couldn’t make it past drx at champs (optic outperformed them at the same tournament) and the same core became mid for the next 2 years. if anything fpx 2022 is more overrated since they were a one-tournament wonder
think before you speak please
its not because fpx won copenhagen its because fpx didnt attend
top 3 team itw not attending because of circumstances outside of losing qualifiers automatically makes iceland the most competitvley unsound tournament
its not because fpx won copenhagen its because fpx didnt attend
if fpx did not win copenhagen then this discussion would not be had at all
I agree you have to take their win with a grain of salt but I think 'only' because of politics is kinda glossing over it
What's to say FPX goes deep but gets eliminated late in lowers (Basically what ended up happening at Champs)
or to say that FPX loses in the GF and ends up having a similar year to GENG last year (for the first 2/3'ds)
obviously, but the people who use your second argument forget that FPX were much better split 1
its very easy to predict FPX were better earlier in the year during iceland
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