Valorant Girls Only Tournament continued

#1

nightwinter14

https://x.com/femaleplayerstn/status/2050974000663208233?s=46

Okay seems like they basically doubled down on rejecting transgender players.

A few thoughts that I had about this was that:

Just a reminder that there is no scientific evidence that males have a biological advantage over females in gaming
I think their response is to be expected as due to their religious beliefs, they don’t recognize separate genders
AI usage for their poster is wrong regardless, you can just use a Riot license-free art
All the openly transphobic comments below the post is disgusting
Not a hill for the lgbtq+ community to die on, because there needs to be a more systematic change in approach to gender in Muslim-faith countries before a dumb Valorant tournament

#2

Clucker

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If there is no biological advantage why have their never been any (significant) female pros in t1. Either valorant has nepotism (shocker) or they just aint good.

#6

mochacat

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there*

also does flor not count

#8

Clucker

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Mb i was walking when i typed that, and no, flor does not count due to genetics and shi

#10

mochacat

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okay well ILOVELESS or asunaluvr r gonna be the next big t1 pro trust

#29

Clucker

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ILL needs the ego boost and asunaluvr will never get past immo 1

#58

Lordsalih

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erm she's immo 2 bro...

#7

nightwinter14

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Gaming culture + population size. Obviously the ratio of women to men in this game is like 1:5. Also girls can feel discouraged from using mics/voice comms because there’s a lotta cringe or teenager kids shitting on them. This stunts their development when learning the game. But I will say it’s definitely not nepotism, as GC teams have historically not been on par with T2 teams. Although there was a drama about a GC pro (I think Noia? could be wrong), not being offered trials allegedly because of her gender but is likely false rumors.

#16

SerialMemester

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meL not Noia

#22

nightwinter14

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Yep, not sure if meL ever commented on it, but imo the rumor was probably wrong because a Riot partner would not risk that allegation

#41

austyns

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meL can't do well in T2 and people thought it was worth scrimming with her for T1? its just not

#20

AegisJT

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Yea. Also presumably selection bias and self-fulfilling prophecies come into play. Even if men had a slight biological edge it largely wouldn't matter. There are large enough variances in human biology to explain make up for any gaps and age plays a more significant role and we still see some uncs playing esports.

#9

nightwinter14

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Also here’s a Reddit link where someone goes deeper in depth about how there is no scientific evidence:

https://www.reddit.com/r/ValorantCompetitive/s/sVAP9vFp0N

#11

Sibao

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The true reason is probably that there's less of a sample size and the ones who are at T2/T1 level would much rather take GC pay then play in a co-ed team and grind Funhavers just for a chance at T1.

#30

nightwinter14

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SRG legit grind and play tournaments like Funhavers all the time…

#32

Sibao

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and srg have shown how good that commitment is but i don't think its a widespread mentality among gc players but idk maybe im wrong

#13

SerialMemester

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player base. For every girl that plays Valo they're several boys that play.

#17

cirruss

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Because women have not had a space in competitive games since forever
No one cares about women's cs, it doesn't matter how good the players are. it took 15+ years of competitive cs for a women's team to even play in a tier 1 tournament. plus half of competitive players just hate women, you can see why they'd be alienated from the space

#24

Maniacwolf

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There’s truth to them being not as good

Shopify is one of the best gc teams and at the bottom of challengers. They’re good players, just not as good as the other players

#37

Elby56

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Because misogyny exists?

#3

WjFROST

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So people are mad about how They're running their OWN tournament?

#4

senyagi

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idc 😭✌️

#5

mondely

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buddy most nothingburger ever. should i go complain cuz it is a girls only tournament and i can’t play as a guy even though scientifically I don’t have much of an advantage?

#12

nightwinter14

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Not sure what your point is here, but I agree it’s should've nothingburger incident, but it kinda went mainstream, and it’s important to be not transphobic.

#15

mondely

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it went mainstream????? where cuz it seems to only be twitter. anyways i don’t think hating on said tournament is how u get muslims and some girls to be less transphobic

#25

nightwinter14

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Idk original post has 7 million views and saw a couple streamers commenting about it. And agreed, a lot of the outrage is performative and not coming from a place where they want real change

#40

mondely

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man twitter level of ragebait is on a whole other level.

#14

Maniacwolf

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yeah that’ll happen

#18

Anguibok

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I strongly beleive that's trans player in GC are the best thing that can happen for cis girl in Valorant.

"Male" team are just really reluctant to hire girl, and girl may be afraid to play with 4 males. So if one day we want to see a cis girl play into tier 1 we might have more chance to see it in a full GC team with trans girl, than a cis girl alone with 4 males. And that's exactly what did happen in T2 : when was the first cis girl to go into tier 2 ? SRGC full GC team. Not a solo cis girl in a male team.

More they are player in the GC playerpool, cis or trans, more it will be doable for the few cis gifted girl to find a roster with 5 other people competitive enough to dream big.

#46

MysticMian

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So you're fully proving the point that biologically male individuals (trans or not) have an advantage over females,

#19

SudokuDude

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They're making an excuse to just be transphobic lol it's just sad...

#21

Maniacwolf

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Why do you say that? They’re just playing Muslim you think? No hate just curious idk anything about the drama

#23

SudokuDude

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They could also just allow trans even if they don't have to agree with it. Sure, it's not a big issue but there's no competitive advantage in gaming. Real life would be a different story.

#26

Maniacwolf

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Why can’t they run their own tournament the way they want if you don’t agree with it? Isn’t that the same thing just on the other side?

#27

SudokuDude

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Maybe I was reading it too deep. I just assumed they were transphobic without reading more into it maybe.

#31

Maniacwolf

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I mean they could be, from my understanding traditional Muslims are against lgbt stuff

#35

fuzziii

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isn't that just transphobic though? like you can't just hide behind a religion

#36

Maniacwolf

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Yeah that’s what i said, and I don’t think they’re hiding behind religion. They don’t want to hide

#42

fuzziii

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by hiding i more meant just using their religion as an excuse. personal subjective beliefs shouldn't be used for hatred

#43

Maniacwolf

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I haven’t read the drama but did they say anything that would qualify as hatred?

continue thread →

#28

laaft

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supported by asmongold was all i needed to see to come to a conclusion

#57

Effluxi

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oh... ew

#33

grisx23

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"Just a reminder that there is no scientific evidence that males have a biological advantage over females in gaming"
this is just wrong btw
there had been no research on speficially gaming stuff
but there are compounding results where men are significantly better at reaction time, hand eye coordination etc, which is paramount to levels pros play at.
Idc about the drama. Just pointing this out

#45

nightwinter14

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“Significantly better” is a huge stretch. There has been studies that show slight increases in men’s favor, the difference amounts to 10-30ms in reaction time. Using a normal distribution this will inevitably lead to at least a quite a few female pros capable to compete at the level of men. And in general this argument is extremely flawed in a game a like Valorant where raw aim is only a portion of what makes a pro good. Take a pro like Primmie, obviously one of the top 10 in the world in terms of aim but is not considered top 10 player in the world. Or Babybay, who is basically a fossil in terms of age reaction time (Reaction time generally slows by about 0.55 ms to 7 ms per year after the mid-20s), but is still considered good enough to dominate in tier 1. There’s just not enough female playerbase and the gaming culture is fundamentally against developing female pros.

#34

tvkxsh1

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"About the support
We've seen a lot of messages of support and people defending us publicly and that means a lot. We've also seen some great support on live streams and Special thanks to
@Asmongold"

and thats all i needed to read to know what kind of shit show this is

#38

SudokuDude

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wait until they find out what he said about Palestine lmfao

#50

tvkxsh1

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🤣🤣

#39

uwukitten

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had me until they listed fucking asmongold 😭😭😭 if you give a shit about the religion you wouldn't associate with that guy in any way

#44

Ross

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Hi, I posted something in a forum awhile back and will restate and reshare just some thoughts regarding this concept as a whole (it doesn’t not perfectly correlate as it’s a repost). In general, yes, there is anthologies advantage between men and women. And it’s the tournament organizers choice. If they want to support women in this manner, that is their choice.

“People are downvoting some basic biology and truth. Albeit esports is not as discussed a topic compared to physical sports in the realm of genetics. But just from what I have studied regarding the specifics of genetics. Their is 100% a genetic component, and that occurs with everything. It can be anything from reaction time, the difference in calcium release from the sarcoplasmic reticulum for the extensor digitorum profundis to lift the hand jjust a focal of an inch, the different in type 1, II, IIb, your dentate nucleus of your cerebellum has a quicker processing speed for planning the fine dextrous movements of the fingers and wrist, etc. There is a genetic component, and this is also why you do not see as many women in the tier 1 scene (I do not even think a woman has made the T1 scene in val or CS yet or not that is biologically a female at birth). Some may view this as a bad thing or even look at the nature vs nurture view for the women argument. But, genetics plays a large role, and it's illogical to think otherwise.
It does not however eliminate hard work, but hard work can not make up for a super large gap that already exists.”

#48

nightwinter14

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Refer to #45. There has been a female pro that I used to watch in the Overwatch League, Geguri (she actually played against Babybay LOL). There is a slight biological component, but it is much more on the environment that prevents more women in professional play. In sports, the less physical it is the closer the competition between men and women, and the gap should logically be narrowest in esports like valorant where skills is one component, and game knowledge, communication, decision making (all of which have 0 biological component) combined is just as if not more important

#54

Ross

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I started my esports “love” in R6. There was a pro named goddess that competed for 3 yrs in competitive R6. The point is not that they can’t. I personally, from the research I have seen, believe in biological advantage especially with regards to sports. I do appreciate the civil dialogue, and we can just agree to disagree. Have a blessed day.

I do want to make one more side note, decision making (just from a reaction speed perspective) and skills def have heavy genetic link imo. Communication and decision making I agree are not biological from the standpoint of it influencing performance benefits.

#47

thom75

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Special thanks to @Asmongold

What a surprise... twitch hitler is backing this

#52

hotnerd

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Once again Female as a category of humans exists and if they want to do something exclusively for themselves then get over it and fuck off

#53

Z0vereign

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who fucking gives a shit nobody would be complaining if this was an only guys tournament

#55

ZzZzZ890

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it's literally their tournament, why does anyone else get to havea say in it? im pro trans people but i don't get why do you need to be dictating terms about how anyone else organises their tournaments, its a game afterall, nothing to be taken thaat seriously.