Who deserves a trial

#1

Nachtel

Make up your minds

did these players deserve a trial?

Demon1 - didn't even try to qualify for challengers, lost to "STEALING LUNCH MONEY" in a Knight's monthly https://www.vlr.gg/159759/stealing-lunch-money-vs-sqn-2-0-knights-monthly-gauntlet-2022-november-playoffs-qf couldn't even make it past Quarterfinals

Jakee - failed to qualify for challengers, on collegiate team

Runi - failed to qualify for challengers

None of these players managed to touch Tier 2 where all the real developing talent is supposedly funneled to

If so, what are the requirements to earn the right to try out for a team?

#2

YvngKurry

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PREACH BROTHA PREACH

#3

Italogee

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FR FR

#4

LimiNaL

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Good stats, being above and beyond your peers, vouches from people on the team

#50

mehdisid

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he won't reply to this one

#52

Nachtel

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because he's not disagreeing with me lol

#5

Brimstan

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they were all prob scouted

#7

Nachtel

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Demon1 wasn't. He went out of his way to go through EG's open tryout process

as for the other two, good scouts know that talent isn't always funneled into T2 like it's supposed to be. The 3rd best smokes player in the league can be rotting away in a collegiate team and only those with a true eye for talent like mCe would know.

#13

axeli

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Demon1 was was scouted by DSG’s coach cause he had a good rep

#20

cboomer

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if u think jakee was just a collegiate player ur such a casual lol

#28

Nachtel

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I'm putting this in the same frame of reference as everyone who unironically thinks you're a bad player if you didn't make it into Tier 2

#23

donut2612

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dsg scouted him then eg poached

#30

Nachtel

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EG poaching him is a misconception. He personally went through their open tryouts process that they advertised on twitter and ended up getting signed to their reserve roster

#38

Brimstan

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teams aren't dumb, and they obviously don't have infinite resources and won't just try out anybody. Like you said, it takes an eye for talent to spot someone like demon1. The talent scouts are there for a reason. They know what they are doing and when someone reaches out to tryout, they will have a reason to decline them other then them being female.

#56

Liem

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jakee isnt top 3 smokes

#6

koromast

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having a dick (only if you were borned with one) according to vlr´s coaches

#8

Prontera

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They don't need trial. They are good enough to compete on high level.

#9

Nachtel

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How would you know without trialing them? Psychic powers?

#11

Prontera

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Like #5 said.

Also is this about mel doesnt get a chance to trial on tier 1 team?

#12

Nachtel

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#5 is wrong.

Demon1 was not scouted

#16

shrubonfire

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wasn’t he scouted by ocean and then EG poached him

#19

LimiNaL

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Vouched by toast too

#17

Prontera

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He is. U just doesnt know. Or refused to know. Also demon1 is proved to be a great player.

#10

tsmsobadholy

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clearly the teams that trialed them thought they were worthy so at the end of the day thats what matters not the opinion of someone on vlr forums lol

#15

Nachtel

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Oh really? did you figure that out by yourself? wowwwwww im so proud

How did my point go over your head

#14

capital_d_colon

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You have to acknowledge that Jakee + runi was an abnormal case in which c9 were looking at cheap replacements.
Tier 2 players were off-limits due to the fact the Challenger League was mid split.

Some of the GC players were also under contract but we don't know if some of the unsigned ones were given an opportunity or not.
Mce watches a lot of valorant, including collegiate, which may be how he found jakee.
NA GC circuit had not restarted at that point.

Demon1 was trialed due to him playing very well against EG in a scrim (when he was playing with DSG).
He was picked up for the EG reserve team.

requirements for trials are slightly arbitrary and are mainly influenced by what a coach deems important.

#22

Nachtel

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I realize that the circumstances were unique, but even if by coincidence this has become a perfect case study into getting to understand the nature of NA's talent pool.

Tier 1 and tier 2 aren't really far apart at all and if even tier 2 rejects can dominate the VCT regular season then that says a lot about our misconceptions regarding the skill level of players who couldn't make challengers (like a certain GC team)

It also highlights definitively that yes, the best player in the world can flounder on a bad team and remain unseen until the right opportunity is handed to him. Demon1 is the perfect example of that

"muh making Tier 2" is not, in my opinion a good enough requirement for getting the opportunity to trial with a tier 1 team

#34

LimiNaL

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Well since it’s more specific to NA players, I believe it’s because NA doesn’t have a league on its own, that many players who could be in VCT aren’t due to the minimal roster spots available on NA orgs. I’d say the reason one could validate “T2 players are good enough” claims is simply that all of NA’s T1 talent isn’t in T1 which is why players like Jakee or runi could be counted as T2 if NA was not just in an Americas league

#37

capital_d_colon

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In my eyes demon1 is an example of the "competitive ladder working" albeit at an accelerated rate.

He proved his value in tier 3 competitions.
Knights monthly stats (min 600 rounds, 1500 opp ranking)

He was scouted by Ocean for his new DSG project.

EG then discovered him after he dropped 40 in a scrim vs them.
Playing against a team in a scrim is inadvertently a mini trial.

Tier 2 NA is uber competitive.
The lack of VCT slots kept the level of competition high.
T2 NA includes a lot of 2022 T1 players, this a rare case in challengers league.

#18

Shawn23

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Quit being corny

Make up your minds

did these players deserve a trial?

Demon1 - didn't even try to qualify for challengers, lost to "STEALING LUNCH MONEY" in a Knight's monthly https://www.vlr.gg/159759/stealing-lunch-money-vs-sqn-2-0-knights-monthly-gauntlet-2022-november-playoffs-qf couldn't even make it past Quarterfinals

He was supposed to be tier 2, was going to join DSG but he ended up shitting on EGs main roster in scrims so they signed him to the reserve, and eg were 0-5 so they said fuck it and threw him in the lineup and randomly became the best player in the league.

Jakee - failed to qualify for challengers, on collegiate team

couldve went Tier 2 , but went collegiate and C9 were on a budget with the release of vanity and Yay, and other players in Tier 2 were already signed to a team so they didnt go tier 1 and you can leave your college team if you want so mCe went after a collegite instead of some random Tier 3 player

Runi - failed to qualify for challengers

Same thing as jake, all the Tier 2 IGLs were signed and no one was avaliable so they picked a random up that no one really knew about because WHO ELSE WERE THEY GOING TO SIGN?

If so, what are the requirements to earn the right to try out for a team?

Theres alot of requirements to earn a spot on a team, and especially as a IGL its much more difficult.

#21

Prontera

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He will try to spin this explanation to the most bullshit thing u read. He is in denial.

#25

Nachtel

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Blud has a grudge against semantics

#27

Prontera

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I hope u have common sense someday. And stop try so hard to being relevant at online forum. Its pathetic.

#31

Nachtel

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Nice argument

#32

sdgdfdrgdrfgdrgdrfttdhy

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semantic arguments are childish and stupid at best.

#33

Nachtel

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Far more childish and stupid for others to strawman your points based on either malicious or dumb interpretations of your argument's wording.

I'm strict about semantics for that reason

#35

sdgdfdrgdrfgdrgdrfttdhy

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Far more childish and stupid for others to strawman your points based on either malicious or dumb interpretations of your wording.

you mean you dont like it when they make a semantic argument about your wording?????

#36

Nachtel

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No, it'd be a semantics argument if they criticized my wording, it's something else when they accept and reinterpret it to suit their argument--whether knowingly or unknowingly

If you've ever been into a debate and realized an hour in that neither of you have the same idea in your head about what you're arguing about then you know what I mean

imo semantics is a way to keep both of you in the same page so that there isn't any confusion or dissonance regarding each other's arguments and standpoints

#39

Nachtel

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Yes, I realize how ironic this is

#41

sdgdfdrgdrfgdrgdrfttdhy

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accept and reinterpret it to suit their argument--whether knowingly or unknowingly

that is a semantic argument just presented as an assertion.

If you've ever been into a debate and realized an hour in that neither of you have the same idea in your head about what you're arguing about then you know what I mean

yea thats never happened to me because i dont argue semantics when actually debating a topic i care about.

imo semantics is a way to keep both of you in the same

its a distraction and waste of time. At best it is used to justify intentional misinterpretation at worst its used as an intellectually dishonest way of attempting to make someone say the opposite of what they mean.

#42

Nachtel

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But you're debating semantics right here, right now with me: about semantics. Is there no value to be had from that?

#44

sdgdfdrgdrfgdrgdrfttdhy

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yup and notice how stupid and childish this argument is

continue thread →

#24

Nachtel

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You're missing the point. see #22

#29

sdgdfdrgdrfgdrgdrfttdhy

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He was supposed to be tier 2

thats the point he didnt have t2 experience still tried out for t1 org.

couldve went Tier 2 , but went collegiate

again u have stumbled right into the point.

Same thing as jake, all the Tier 2 IGLs were signed and no one was avaliable

and say it with me one last time thats the fuckin point.

t2 experience is not a prerequisite for getting a t1 try out. are you daft or disingenuous?

#40

LimiNaL

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Well runi has the better resume from who c9 could pick from as he was a good igl for soniqs who were very close to making T2. It’s not like runi fluked onto c9 he had a decent background before that “experience” I guess

#43

sdgdfdrgdrfgdrgdrfttdhy

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and none of that was the point of the original post. The point of the post was to be a smart ass and attempt to point and laugh at the dumbasses who think t2 experience is a pre-req to even get a t1 try out.

#49

LimiNaL

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Oh I see

#54

Shawn23

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ignore him, no one will every get signed to a Tier 1 org without any tier 2 expereince, hes obv on a alt account saying stupid shit

#53

Shawn23

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r u dumb ? Demon1 trialed FOR A TIER 2 TEAM WHICH WAS DSG, he shit on EG and they signed him, he never once tried out for a tier 1 org.

#59

sdgdfdrgdrfgdrgdrfttdhy

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🤷‍♂️im just goin off your own words lil bro

#61

Shawn23

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you obv didnt ? demon1 trialed for dsg and got signed for shitting on eg

jake only got picked up bc they couldnt get anyone from tier 2 bc they were all signed

runi shouldve never been there tbh and probably wont even make a tier 2 team this year, use your head

#26

orthoboy

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Only in NA tier 1 and tier 2 are not that far apart in other regions t1 farms t2 NA is a competitive region on a whole

#46

TheAqif

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preach brother preach

#48

Kiko

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i deserve a trial

#51

shrubonfire

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botssi deserves a trial

#55

titanwithpp

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Everyone does but not everyone will get it

#57

Liem

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didn't even try to qualify for challengers

he was already close to signing with EG. why would he play qualifier for challengers

#58

Nachtel

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your timeline is so fucking wrong im not even gonna respond to that lol

#60

Pengu12

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But he would’ve played regardless if eg didn’t sign him

#62

Liem

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Dsg wanted to sign demon1 before quals for challengers. the only reason he didnt sign was bc of EG