the guy has taken every agent(except gekko) and brought it to the highest stage of valorant, all while igling and fragging HEAVILY. i'm not the craziest fan of PRX, but i'm sorry, this guy has been around since the beginning and has CONSISTENTLY performed well. only other guy that has stayed this consistent is maybe aspas, but he's only on duelist. the fact forsaken is doing ts on EVERY AGENT is insane
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Forsaken is the goat unfortunately
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gotta give it to him he is goated and such a nice guy also im kinda sad that he's in prx ngl
aspas used to be insanely consistent. This year and most of last, however, he hasn't been.
so doesn't that mean he's not consistent he was great for 2 yrs 22 23, Mid overall in 2024, 2025 very off and now beggining of 26 no real impact
Top international player since 22 is not consistency? Sure he had bad tournaments but overall hes managing to keep the level up every year
I'd say Alfajer also fits this criteria individually and Boaster in results/igling
Since when is aspas top international player? Other than 24 champs and paris when have we seen him. And no don't give me the bad team bs
Nvm my brain short circuited lmao
22 masters reykjavik, 22 champs, 23 lockin, 23 champs? do you not watch valorant at all or
Ngl gng I started watching around tokyo time so my knowledge from the pre tokyo period is from vlr mb
last time we fight edg won champs while prx players are crying on the airplane LMAO
LMFAO. Then we never meet again cause y'all almost never qualified (or bombed out of group stage)
and we win Toronto, and 4th at champs.
Didn't see EDG at all there.
or do you also want me to list the results before 2025?
I don't want to say edg fluke win, but you really push some funny button around my head rn
Goat with 1 good tour..He was known for shitting bed in int.
Toronto is the only good one out of 12.
Santiago is 2nd if he can keep up in playoffs.
champs 23 masters copanhagen Masters ReykjavĂk and tokyo madrid all top 4 or better ranging from 22-24 with a win in 25 and another top 4
and he didn't shit the bed generally either 0.96 or over 1 kd for his international Performances (22 ReykjavĂk was his best shockingly) good or above avg performances
that being said his main goat convo admission is his flexbility and mechs and flexing to igl for sure and his longevity as a player
hes the best flex, but he is not as consistent as aspas in an all time perspective and also never won the Champions trophy, i would put him somewhere inside the Top 10, but to put him on Top 1 is just overreaction over recency bias
okay fine just bc he hasn't won a champs trophy i'll stick him in the top 3. who is above him in terms of ALL TIME
maybe derke or chron can be ahead of him, but that's where i draw the line for fnc players
I think at very least, probably Aspas (stats + Champions trophy), Alfajer (stats+trophies), Derke (stats + trophies), Meteor (trophies), Sacy (trophies), Ethan (Champions trophies), zekken (stats), Less (stats + Champions trophy) are all above him
Zekken and less.... Are we dead serious
This is why we don't listen to this guy about goats
he for sure has passed zekken at this point and Less and will probably pass Derke with one more bad year out of him a champions trophy from 22 is honestly less valuable then a masters today
both zekken and f0rsaken have 1 Masters + 1 Masters MVP, zekken has a higher international rating all-time and a higher kill diff
Less also has a higher international rating all time and the Champions trophy
Derke also still has a higher international rating and 1 more trophy
you don't even need to look at stats, just look at the impact that he has had in the server
every player in the Top 10 all time is very impactful
just because one or two of them are being impactful right now, it doesnt erase the history of the others
the other guy really said:
a champions trophy from 22 is honestly less valuable then a masters today
When f0rsaken was playing VCT 2022 and lost a Masters to ardiis of all people
playing or not a 22 champs trophy doesnt matter as much as in trophy in 24-25 its too old for allat and the players who played in it proved it with aspas being the only one of the 4 who isn't washed saddhak and less have had 2 back to back bad years
and it was his first grand final like loud's first grand final where they lost to FNS of all people
i dont think i'll be able to change your mind, and its okay
either way, here is some prime Less ball knowledge so we dont forget that he is him đ:
he IS him dont get me wrong he is goated but goat convo isn't a place for cope he has had 2 back to back bad years that f0rsaken didnt have as of now he clears cause less has at least to 1 year make up even with his all time performances to get past f0rsaken he is potentially considered washed rn if he doesnt pop off on KRU
zekken is on primary duelist f0rsaken was on flex igl having higher rating is to be expected when u arent igl'ing + flexing and generally speaking all of these players have had a 1-2 bad years in recent years which matters more since the modern years are harder= they matter more
with less having the worst fall off of the 3 he clears one of these guys for sure and its probably less unless he locks in on KRU
but regardless a flex igl being compared to these guys is win in it self not to mention stats are overrated and when u look at his actual impact in the server you would know he clears less and probably zekken since he still hasn't had a off year as bad as the 2 with less being mega washed unless he proves it other wise on KRU and zekken of duelist is a poor sight
alr alr hold on
aspas--> yes
Alfajer-->fine bc he is another player that's not talked about NEARLY enough(he genuinely will be one of the goats of valorant)
Derke-->i guess but like i don't see derke being in the same tier as aspas. i'm not taking away from his achievments, he is one of the best players, but if GOAT tier is S tier, i'd put derke in A+ tier. he needs another popoff year imo
Meteor--> Not yet. he's one of my favorite players, but i don't think that meteor should be in the same tier as aspas just yet because he HAS been seen to be inconsistent. I'd say Meteor is A tier just because we haven't seen him at the top top for THAT long
Sacy--> i'm sorry but i just can't in my right mind say that forsaken is below sacy because let's be real, sacy was carried(at least for madrid. i didn't watch Loud that much back in 2022, so i can't speak about his impact then). doesn't mean he didn't have an impact on the team, but forsaken has had a much more profound impact on PRX, including firepower
Ethan-->I can hear this, but i think the fact that forsaken is usually at the top of the leaderboard means that not only is he good in his role, but he's doing it while having better aim.
zekken--> nah this i can't really hear because look at how zekken is doing when he's not on a duelist. zekken really needs to perform this year if we want to put zekken in the goat tier. he's not bad at all, but he's not above forsaken
Less--> cmon, he's a great player, but he's not stayed consistently at the top. I know it's partly because he didn't make that many internationals(only the first internationals of '24 and '25), and maybe we'd see better stuff if he made more internationals, but f0rsaken has been to almost every international save for one i think.
i know i am contradicting in some of these, but tldr half these players you can't say are above f0rsaken just because they have more trophies
ngl i dont even know if he is the best flex. Maybe he is the best player to be on the flex role, because his mechanics are just that elite, but I don't think that his level of utility usage when switching roles is that crazy. I feel like his mechanics are just so insane that it doesn't matter who he is playing, he is going to do well - which makes him look like the "best flex", but he is just a very talented player that gets plugged into whatever role because it doesn't matter.
who would you put above him?
i just feel like we see so many great players making role switches and them shitting the bed afterwards
I would have Chronicle over him. We've seen him play various characters across Sentinel/Controller/Initiator while providing elite supportive util and playing his role to near perfection. He doesn't have to lean on his mechanics to bail him out by just outaiming people, he plays his roles well, whether its support util for teammates on initiator, anchoring sites on sentinel, or providing lurk pressure on controller.
yeah i mean i get what you're saying, but forsaken has also played duelist, which is the exact opposite of being a lurk/anchor, yk? i think his diversity should be praised more than it is
Yeah, don't get me wrong, he is EASILY in that 2nd spot for me behind Chronicle. Hell, the way it looks now, if they make a run here at Santiago, I would put him over Chron. I do find his diversity to be very impressive, but I haven't been amazed by his utility if I am honest. It doesn't feel like his impact on the server is tied to the character or role he is playing, rather his mechanics and aim, which for me takes away from his impact as a "flex player". Is he really all that flexible, or is he just such a monster mechanically that he can play whatever and he will still aim diff you?
would you put smoggy in goat flex contention or would you say he's like forsaken and just really good at shooting
you guys have an agent pool fetish, not that hard to average 1 rating with a large pool of agents
no else can do it except chron and f0rsaken if it was so easy we wouldn't have had like 7 teams die from role issues in vct so either it is hard or seemingly teams are choosing to lose instead of having a player avg 1.0 regionally and internationally on every agent
that being said i dont think f0rsaken is THE GOAT yet but he has a solid case for top 5 being in the convo on igl + best flex in the game
but he isn't usually the best player on the team d4v4i is usually there best player
he is a good player with good flexibility but thats about it. Maybe if he focuses on less agents and try to master them he would be more consistent
he is one the best in the game and he is best the flex in the game* he has bare minimum half his pool mastered btw
jusst because he can shoot doesnt mean hes good on the agents. a good flex doesnt run down main as a smoker
Agent playing stats donât matter boi it about how is utilising the agent in his way
Also he not playing more than 10 Agents for the time being
For him the argument for top 1 is possible :
Winning Champs trophy with a very good performance along with his team can put him top 1
Or Win b2b trophy doesnât matter if itâs master or champs
Could directly put him in top 1
all these other goats are only playing a select number of agents, and mainly in a specific role. forsaken is playing at the highest level on so many different agents
i get the thing about his util, but people have no problem saying aspas is the goat when he's only playing duelist and just wracking up kills
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