58

f0rsaken is the best.

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#1
Subreezy

I've been seeing people talk about how t3xture, Less, zekken, etc. are the best players in the world, but holy fuck most of you have been sleeping on f0rsaken. It actually baffles me how much people claim that f0rsaken is below the top 5, let alone top 3 or even #1 in the world. Keep in mind, he has been with PRX's core since 2021 (hasn't team hopped) and became the player he is today in APAC/Pacific, a region that isn't nearly as competitive as NA, Brazil, or EMEA.

CONTEXT:

For those of you who didn't know, with the inclusion of something in the roster in 2023 (around Region Week 3), f0rsaken was pushed off of Duelist and became a heavy flex player. PRX got knocked out Round 1 at LOCK//IN, so this change was necessary. He had to pick up agents he had barely played before like KJ, Harbor, Cypher, Skye, Fade, and Neon, meaning he had to play literally every role, sometimes all 4 roles in 1 series. Most pros can't play more than 1 role, yet he adapted to the necessary changes MID-SEASON and OVERPERFORMED.

Then in Tokyo, he had to play his flex roles AND pick up something's Jett due to his visa issues. They Got 3rd with a PUBG streamer sub and beat DRX, EDG, and NRG, bringing the future Champs winners to 5 maps.

In Champs, he performed well in most of the series, but he didn't have to do insanely well because he had something and Jinggg together. PRX got 2nd with their roster at full firepower. People can say that something/Jinggg were the difference makers in 2023, but without f0rsaken's role changes, something would have never fit onto the team.

Did I mention that he was confirmed primary IGLing for the entirety of the 2023 season (after Benkai's departure)?

Now in 2024 with the loss of Jinggg and the inclusion of Monyet, well, we all knew Monyet wasn't going to live up to Jinggg's legacy. But, Monyet replaced Jinggg's Raze and f0rsaken stayed on flex, playing every role in the 3 series they played in the regional kick-off. Despite Monyet's performance on Raze (5/18 FK/FD against GenG...), they qualified to Madrid.

HE'S THE GOAT:

With that context now out of the way, I wanna focus on TH vs. PRX. With their backs on the line at 1-1 and going into Split, a map that EDG just dismantled them on, what does PRX elect to do? They put f0rsaken on Raze for the first time SINCE JINGGG JOINED PRX with less than a day's notice. Any average player would 100% get LAN jitters, but not f0rsaken. 22/12. 322 ACS. 5/4 FK/FD. 3 2Ks, 1 3K, and 2 4Ks. All this against TH, a SPANISH ORG WITH A HEAVY CROWD BUFF. Absolute fucking masterclass on Raze, and I truly believe that anyone else in his shoes would have crumbled under pressure. There's a reason he's the highest stat flex player at Madrid, despite playing 5 different agents in 6 maps.

Sure, he hasn't won a Masters or Champs, but I challenge people here to name another player who can possibly be considered better than f0rsaken GIVEN HIS HISTORY. He moved from CS:GO in 2021, dealt with the hell that was APAC open qualifiers (IYKYK) and finally qualified for an international after 6 months of failure, brought Yoru to international play in 2022 and literally changed the game, adapted to the Chamber meta and brought peak FPX to Map 5 at Copenhagen, adapted away from the Chamber meta and kept his relevance and performance into a necessary flex/IGL role, scoring another 3rd at Tokyo and 2nd at Champs by doing so, and has now stepped up to play an agent he hasn't played in 3 years in an elimination map against Madrid's crowd favorite. And he's done all this with a smile.

f0rsaken is the goat. end of story.

#2
KilOOty
22
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🐐

#3
Tryeue1
13
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🐐

#4
pickleguy483
-33
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bro spent 30 minutes typing for 2 comments.

#69
Subreezy
1
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i got a lot more than 2 comments i think

#5
LouBag
-14
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Trembo level glazing

#58
OkOkay
-4
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More delusional than trembo for sure. Shitcific fans are unreal

#6
Fruitless
9
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🐐

#7
pixh
0
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tldr

#8
Subreezy
20
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tl;dr people are calling rookies #1 when f0rsaken has played every role + IGL and by far has the deepest agent pool out of any other Tier 1 talent (maybe Chronicle is tied), all while performing to an insane extent

#9
chloeburbank
3
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🐐

#10
highlyte
3
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🐐

#11
NoCheatJustLag
15
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crazy to think that he's only 19 but already have like 6+ years of experience in esport

#12
JamBrrr
1
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🐐

#13
GaeHGae
-31
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No one cares about that fraud. Less clears him as a flex 🇧🇷

#14
Subreezy
12
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Less has played 2 agents this year. I wouldn't consider him a flex compared to f0rsaken

you're probably baiting but ik people actually think this

#18
GaeHGae
-10
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Who's the world champion again? Less wouldn't choke trophy twice like ur goat foreskin 😂

#21
Subreezy
2
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https://www.vlr.gg/316627/tenz-is-getting-carried

opinion rejected

#23
GaeHGae
0
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https://x.com/willminder/status/1769456431126757863?s=20

where is foreskin

#24
Subreezy
1
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this isn't the burn you think it is

#35
Karmine_Org_WhispeR
0
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Less wouldn’t choke trophy twice

Masters Reykjavik 2022
Lock-In Sao Paulo 2023

#36
Psion
0
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  • that was a 3-0 how was it a choke
  • they were down 2-0 and almost brought it back
#40
Karmine_Org_WhispeR
3
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• Lost map 1; Ascent (Supposedly their best map), lost on OT twice

• Map 5; Choked an 11-3 lead

#15
raikiiii
3
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are you braindead? look at the both players past agent usage in 60 days.

#25
airbender
6
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less - viper(89%) and cypher(11%). what a commendable variety in the agent pool. clearly, the greatest flex player. 😂😂

#16
soariner
1
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🐐

#17
Mebi
0
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🐐

Just a very minor error, his neon was played for fracture in 2022 as the primary duelist together with Jinggg's raze, and he was damn good on it too.

#19
Subreezy
0
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nah im aware of it, when i mentioned the Chamber meta i didn't mean he ONLY played Chamber, moreso he was able to pick up Chamber and play him in Copenhagen/Champs and didn't have a major fall off like yay or ardiis after the Chamber meta died

#20
Psion
-4
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saadhak > f0rsaken for goat status lmao

#32
Subreezy
2
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i agree that saadhak is a great IGL, but it's hard to compare him to f0rsaken. saadhak is more of a coach IGL who can easily perform when necessary, but f0rsaken is more of a player IGL, where being an IGL is secondary to him being a flex player. they're both great at what they do, but i think what f0rsaken does is way harder due to how little people are able to be a 4 role flex to the degree he does it as

#34
Psion
0
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things saadhak has that f0rsaken doesn't

  • 2 more international events
  • 1 more playoffs made
  • 1 more podium finish
  • 1 more event win
  • 1 more champions win
  • better igl
    things f0rsaken has
  • a little over .03 better rating at international events than saadhak
  • better mechanics
  • played 2-3 more agents depending on minimum # of games to be considered playing it
#41
Subreezy
5
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not sure why cherry picked data and podium placements correlates to someone being innately better than someone else

by that logic zombs is better than KangKang

#44
Psion
0
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accolades are a huge part of every single goat debate dude

#46
Subreezy
0
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why doesn't agent pool, flexibility, enjoyability to play with, aim, utility usage, and game sense matter more than accolades? we're not talking about teams, we're talking about individuals. the scrim partners PRX has are WAY worse than the scrim partners LOUD has (evident with the triple duelist comp, it kept working in Pacific so why change it?), so no shit they have a higher likelihood of getting accolades. swap f0rsaken onto GenG, LOUD, or SEN (ignoring language barriers) and i think he'd win Madrid hands down. him as an individual player is so useful it's crazy.

#47
Psion
0
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"agent pool, flexibility, enjoyability to play with, aim, utility usage, and game sense" even if the combination of these and accolades is worth 50-50
agent pool- similar agent pools(slightly favors f0rsaken)
flexibility- how is this different than agent pools
enjoyability to play with- literally doesn't matter in a goat debate and even if it did they aren't comparable
aim- forsaken
utility usage- similar(slightly favors saadhak or equal)
game sense- saadhak(literally the smartest player in the game, he's made phoenix work, came up with viper-harbor-skye meta, etc)
and saadhak has way more accolades
and accolades matter because people years down the line aren't looking at how good you were in X position, they look at awards, accolades, and stats

#22
Asuna_Yuuki
1
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Saadhak >

#26
Astar
4
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🐐

W glazing thread i approve

#27
Existential_crisis
3
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Forsaken has a great aim aimbot plus fragging power , game sense , and huge agent pool ocean .

#28
DaddyCool123
2
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Great analysis

#29
Marcusgeez
3
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king without a crown. hopefully he'll get that trophy soon 🐐

#30
J7z
4
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You know what, well fucking done man and I agree. Good job

#31
Subreezy
0
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thanks bro! excited for KC vs PRX today

#33
silh0uette
0
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YEAA!!! PUT SOME RESPECT ON THE GOATS NAME!

#37
Nipstyx
0
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I Agree. He is HEAVILY underestimated

#38
proud_bandwagoners
0
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Whats with these sudden f0rsaken glazers. Not that I disagree tho

#39
Subreezy
0
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nah i've been saying this since late 2022-2023, i think the TH series and him hopping on raze made everyone realize how crazy this guy can actually be. that and more streamers talked about his flex stats which made their fans start to post about him

either way im happy he's starting to get the recognition he deserves

#42
ZettGundam
1
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He wins 4 tournaments in a row if he's in an NA team

#45
Hashib
0
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that team is 100t/c9

#43
Burongki
1
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🐐

#48
MrNonsense
0
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🐐

#49
CoCloudy
0
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https://www.vlr.gg/314488/forsaken-faker

#51
Subreezy
0
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bro got 3 kills on a site hold to close out map 3? fucking goat

#52
bearmans
1
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i read allat and i agree.

#53
Subreezy
0
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factual

#54
KajotLord
0
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🐐🐐

#55
Subreezy
1
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today against LOUD: 9/2 FK/FD on fade and kayo, f0rsakeN is still the flex goat

#56
skibidiyesyes
1
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cant dispute against it

#57
Subreezy
0
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thank you skibidiyesyes

#59
SAMPV6
3
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f0rsaken really is the goat, he balls on every character in the game and you always see him vibing, never tilting, he is such an amazing flexible player.

Every team should have the privilege of playing with a player like him at least once.

He is the 🐐

#60
Subreezy
2
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+

when he was playing raze against TH, he was IGLing split alongside something. bro put up insane numbers for an elimination game AND IGLed.

#63
SAMPV6
0
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Oh my god. He really IGL'd and put up insane numbers. He truly is a machine amongst ordinary men, my one and only goat.

#61
kuzch
2
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Been saying this, even when some of my fellow Indonesians were calling him overrated. When he's hot, he's the best player in the world, just like his teammates said. Just need to work on his grand final jitters

#62
meadows
1
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+

🐐

#64
hibestie
0
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🐐

#65
Typer
0
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🐐

#66
Cezka000
0
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A flex who can play 5 agents or more with crispy aim, easy top 5 eaaasy

#68
Subreezy
0
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just off the top of my head, he regularly plays/has played:

Jett
Raze
Yoru
Neon
Chamber
Kayo
Fade
Cypher
KJ
Harbor
Skye
Sova
Breach

#67
kanyefan4238173
0
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+

he would be the goat if he won anything

i love this post for everything other than claiming hes the goat

https://www.vlr.gg/112327/paper-rex-vs-funplus-phoenix-valorant-champions-tour-stage-2-masters-copenhagen-gf/?game=90662&tab=overview

map 5, grand final, his team is expected to win after winning the upper final and having the 2 map ban advantage. he drops a .5 rating 21 death game on a 9-13 map in which they had a 9-7 lead

if he makes up for it with a masters/champs win hed be the goat. but for now, a guy whos never won anything, and didnt show up during his greatest opportunity, cannot be the goat

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