they can just run a gekko comp on sunset, it’s not out of the meta

zekken raze john fade n4rrate gekko zellsis brim bang viper

btw how do you even find news abt how much ppls buyouts are?

btw how do you even find news abt how much ppls buyouts are?

the thing is i’ve mostly seen people rating them lowly

Verno's also played Brimstone in the past in certain comps, and also Yoru, KJ, etc. I think he's pretty flexible.

that's only because of Alfa's insane aim though, they were borderline pugging that map.

Asuna - Neon, Cryo - ? Do you stick Cryo on Breach and hope for the best? or Cryo Omen, bang Breach? or Cryo Sova, eeiu Breach? not a huge fan of either of those options.

Same with maps like Sunset, where the duelist isn't Jett and it's a double initiator, 100T run into some trouble with roles.

i agree with your point about asuna's agent pool, but for instance, that haven comp, while being a good one-off comp, probably isn't good enough to make it your main choice. there isn't a way for Asuna to fit into the meta Breach comp on haven, unless he were to play breach, which he hasn't done at all. Obviously this is rather nitpicky, but the same concept could apply to other maps.

and there were many problems with NRG, replacing Victor with someone else wasn't going to change much.

jawgemo is 100% the better player but as an NRG fan I didn't want to hope for too much lmao
I agree with all your points though that is an insanely stacked lineup

these are all actually crazy good

I like the trio of brawk flyuh and v1c a lot, i'd rather have Mitch over flyuh though, and crashies/marved have proven more than brawk/v1c, but if they wanted to gamble on younger players instead then I like the alternative.

I also rly like the furbsa shoutout, that guy is insane

you'd rather keep Asuna?
I think Victor provides the same aggressive playstyle as Asuna while adding both championship experience and flexibility. For example, on Haven 100T had to play a Sova-KAY/O comp, which is very uncommon on Haven and frankly not quite as good. With Victor replacing Asuna, he could easily play Killjoy and have Boostio flex to Breach. Vic can also play Raze to a similar, if not higher, level than Asuna and he was the one that pioneered Neon all the way back in 2022 (and we saw limited flashes of this level this year).
I must admit that I'm an OPTIC fan who wants Vic to get picked up by someone, but I truly think he's a better fit than Asuna.

G2 -icy +Jawgemo
Clear upgrade over icy. G2 becomes serious contenders.

SEN -Sacy +N4rrate
This would be a pipe dream, N4rrate can play Jett on Ascent/Abyss/Icebox where zekken can play Sova. He adds to an already fragging-heavy Sentinels team.

NRG -Victor -crashies +mada +Verno
Obviously if they can get Demon1 they should but mada is 100% the next-best alternative. He had the highest rating in Challengers and showed flashes of being an absolute demon. Verno obviously is a no-brainer, with the bonkar connection another factor.

100T -Asuna +Victor
This is where it starts to get controversial, I think Asuna's time has come and replacing him with Victor, arguably NRG's best player in split 1, is to me at the very least a sidegrade-risk worth taking. Victor also fits well next to Cryo, with the added benefit of being able to play sentinel and Boostio playing Gekko/Breach if needed.

C9 -(everyone except OXY) +Marved +XXiF +mitch +crashies
They build a new team around OXY. mitch is the best IGL on the market by far and Marved/crashies brings incredible vet experience while also being insane players in their own right. If I'm C9, I'm taking the odds that at least one of them is reverting to their peak form. XXiF is the best sentinel in T2 NA and probably their best choice if they want to move on from moose.

EG -everyone +gMd +v1c +zeldris +Rossy +brawk
This is a random budget roster I pieced together, in the style of EG. gMd is probably the next best IGL, v1c and brawk are perhaps the best remaining T2 players, zeldris is a beast obviously, and Rossy rounds out with vet experience.

Thoughts? what moves do you want to see?

earlier in the year he was playing Cypher in their sunset comp, which accounts for most of the rounds. he also played Cypher in this Lotus game.

yeah I had to make the cutoff 100 rounds, so that excludes a lot of ppl like w0ot on iso and heybay/mazino on deadlock

(Minimum 100 rounds)

Astra

Highest rated - TLN JitBoyS - 1.33 rating
Lowest rated - FNC Boaster - 0.74 rating
Most played - FPX BerLIN - 585 rounds

Breach

Highest rated - TS invy - 1.19 rating
Lowest rated - TLN Crws and BBL pAura - 0.76 rating
Most played - TE heybay - 490 rounds

Brimstone

Highest rated - LOUD tuyz - 1.25 rating
both CHICHOO and Smoggy have higher vlr ratings, but these only include their games at Champs/Kickoff, and don't take into account the regular season games. Other Chinese players may be disqualified by similar criteria.
Lowest rated - DRX MaKo - 0.96 rating
heybay has far worse stats than MaKo and likely would have a lower rating
Most played - G2 valyn - 358 rounds

Chamber

Highest rated - T1 Sayaplayer - 1.23 rating
Lowest rated - FUT cNed - 1.12 rating
Most played - T1 xccurate - 244 rounds

Clove

Highest rated - EDG Smoggy - 1.27 rating
Lowest rated - DRX Flashback - 1.11 rating (Life has worse stats but again the China thing)
Most rounds - EDG Smoggy - 123 rounds

Cypher

Highest rated - KC MAGNUM - 1.25 rating
Lowest rated - EG Apoth - 0.79 rating (Yosemite has worse stats)
Most rounds - TH benjyfishy - 1264 rounds

Deadlock

Highest rated - SEN johnqt - 0.92 rating
Lowest rated - SEN johnqt - 0.92 rating
Most rounds - SEN johnqt - 105 rounds

Fade

Highest rated - KC N4RRATE - 1.34 rating
Lowest rated - BBL reazy - 0.82 rating
Most played - 100T eeiu - 599 rounds

Gekko

Highest rated - KC N4RRATE - 1.17 rating
Lowest rated - BBL reazy - 0.72 rating
Most played - FPX AAAAY - 713 rounds

Harbor

Highest rated - TLN JitBoyS - 1.17 rating
Lowest rated - DFM neth - 0.72 rating (DRG Shion7 is also a contender)
Most played - LEV Mazino - 599 rounds

Iso

Highest rated - FNC Alfajer - 1.43 rating
Lowest rated - FNC Alfajer - 1.43 rating
Most played - FNC Alfajer - 156 rounds

Jett

Highest rated - 100T Cryocells - 1.30 rating
Lowest rated - TH MiniBoo - 0.74 rating
Most played - GenG t3xture - 1256 rounds

KayO

Highest rated - TS invy - 1.20 rating
Lowest rated - MIBR mazin - 0.69 rating
Most played - GenG Munchkin - 933 rounds

Killjoy

Highest rated - FNC Alfajer - 1.09 rating (CHICHOO, FengF, Kai, Rb are all possibly higher rated)
Lowest rated - TLN Surf - 0.78 rating
Most played - GenG Meteor - 1330 rounds

Neon

Highest rated - VIT Sayf - 1.29 rating
Lowest rated - LOUD saadhak - 0.78 rating (TvirusLuke possibly worse)
Most played - TH MiniBoo - 759 rounds

Omen

Highest rated - 100T bang - 1.19 rating (CHICHOO possibly higher)
Lowest rated - NAVI ANGE1 - 0.63 rating
Most played - GenG Karon - 1425 rounds

Phoenix

Highest rated - M8 nataNk - 1.13 rating
Lowest rated - LOUD qck - 0.98 rating
Most played - LOUD qck - 284 rounds

Raze

Highest rated - FNC Alfajer - 1.32 rating
Lowest rated - BLD yay and GIA Fit1nho - 0.76 rating
Most played - GenG t3xture - 1125 rounds

Reyna

Highest rated - PRX something - 1.07 rating
Lowest rated - PRX something - 1.07 rating
Most played - PRX something - 178 rounds

Sage

Highest rated - PRX d4v41 - 1.17 rating
Lowest rated - TL Mistic - 0.76 rating
Most played - PRX d4v41 - 287 rounds

Skye

Highest rated - TS Wild0reoo - 1.12 rating
Lowest rated - MIBR mazin - 0.77 rating (TEC QuiYe possibly worse)
Most played - GenG Lakia - 763 rounds

Sova

Highest rated - FNC Leo - 1.28 rating
Lowest rated - M8 beyAz - 0.77 rating (DRG Dingwei possibly worse)
Most played - TH RieNs - 1265 rounds

Viper

Highest rated - FNC Chronicle - 1.21 rating
Lowest rated - FUR kon4n - 0.68 rating
Most played - GenG Munchkin - 1451 rounds

Yoru

Highest rated - NAVI ardiis - 1.33 rating
Lowest rated - G2 icy - 0.71 rating
Most played - FNC Derke - 494 rounds

Americas:
Controller: s0m
Sentinel: leaf
Duelist: aspas
Flex/IGL: kiNgg
Initiator: zekken

EMEA:
Controller/IGL: MrFaliN
Sentinel: Chronicle
Duelist: Wo0t
Flex: N4RRATE
Initiator: Leo

APAC:
Controller: primmie
Sentinel/IGL: d4v41
Duelist: something
Flex: f0rsaken
Initiator: invy

CN:
Controller: Smoggy
Sentinel: v0okashu
Duelist: Kai
Flex: Zmjjkk
Initiator: AAAAY
(no IGL needed)

current. All time some very different picks would have been made

no way bro has SA flair still saying that

i was debating at the last second, in the end i just wanted at least one chinese player lmao, but i could 100% see the argument for zekken

A: aspas
B: BuZz
C: Chronicle
D: Derke
E: Elite
F: f0rsaken
G: grubinho
H: heat
I: invy
J: Jinggg
K: Karon
L: Leo
M: MaKo (Meteor?)
N: N4RRATE
O: OXY
P: paTiTek
Q: qRaxs
R: RieNs
S: something
T: t3xture
U: UNFAKE (literally no tier 1 players)
V: valyn
W: Wo0t
X: xccurate
Y: yetujey
Z: ZmjjKK (zekken?)

Okobotro 🗿

aproto?

This is a list of top 10 NA T2 players that I think should be in franchising (excluding M80 + TSM)

1. Verno
2. mada
3. v1c
4. brawk
5. corey
6. skuba
7. mitch
8. XXiF
9. penny
10. zeldris

Honorable mentions: Bob, Spaz, bdog, thief

These may not be the best players in this order per se, but just based on what I'd like to see.

Thoughts?

damn ppl are still watching him?

B

his stats havent looked good at all recently...
i dont follow japan challengers, could anyone who does talk to how he's doing right now?

me too, but idk if the role changes are worth it to do it consistently.

e.g. on icebox,
s0m jett
FNS Viper
Victor Killjoy
Ethan KAY/O
Crashies Gekko

that's not horrible.

or on Split:
s0m jett
FNS Viper
Victor Raze
Ethan Omen
crashies Skye

i do agree that jett is still extremely strong on haven, but the question is is it worth putting Vic on Jett, an agent that he's not the most comfortable on (playable still ofc), over a slightly more off-meta, but more comfortable agent? I dont think jett is necessary to the point like ascent where it will have a 95+% pick rate.

iso 👀

thanks (:

someone else called my haven comp ancient - neon hasn’t been played on haven since early 2022 iirc. at least raze fade was popular until just before chamber meta ended.

i would love to see them experiment though. i do agree that the raze comp was a bit of a stretch, neon would be interesting.

i thought the viper nerfs would mean teams stay away from her, except for icebox where she’s literally necessary, but that’s definitely the way i’d structure the viper comp

i tried

i actually like this a lot more, wasnt really thinking about the harbor comps on this map. have people played harbor comps with no duelist before?

harbor was only meta on haven because of viper-harbor swamp comp, do you think that's still viable with both viper and skye nerfs since then? i personally think breach comps are going to work better now

if so then vic jett, ethan skye, fns kj, crashies viper, s0m harbor?

Ascent:
Victor Jett
s0m Omen
FNS Killjoy
crashies Sova
Ethan KAY/O

OVR 8/10

Haven:
Victor Raze
s0m Omen
FNS Killjoy
crashies Fade
Ethan Breach

OVR 8/10

Icebox:
Victor KAY/O
s0m Viper
FNS Killjoy
crashies Gekko
Ethan Sage

OVR 6.5/10

Split:
Victor Raze
s0m Viper
FNS Cypher
crashies Skye
Ethan Omen

OVR 7.5/10

Lotus:
Victor Neon
s0m Omen
FNS Killjoy
crashies Gekko
Ethan Breach

OVR 7/10

Bind:
Victor Raze
s0m Brimstone
FNS Viper
crashies Gekko
Ethan Skye

OVR 8.5/10

Sunset:
Victor Neon
s0m Omen
FNS Cypher
crashies Sova
Ethan Breach

OVR: 6.5/10

Victor agent pool: Jett, Raze, KAY/O, Neon
s0m agent pool: Omen, Viper, Brimstone
FNS agent pool: Killjoy, Viper, Cypher
crashies agent pool: Sova, Fade, Gekko, Skye
Ethan agent pool: KAY/O, Sage, Breach, Omen, Skye

The roles I think end up working out pretty well, each player is comfortable on their agents.

I stuck with somewhat meta comps, but I'd also like to see some experimentation maybe, especially considering they could be gearing for a 2025 run instead of focusing on the now.

Thoughts?

fuck cancer

Does yay play Neon?

The comp is:
Chamber
Harbor
Sova
Viper/Astra/Omen
Gekko/KayO/Breach

Essentially, Chamber fills two important roles of oping and holding site/flank, essentially combining a Jett (oping part only) and a Killjoy into one, slightly less effective version of both. The reason for this is to open up other roles - namely, double controller and double intiator.

Harbor is I think the best smoker for this map, he's the only smoker that can effectively smoke B and he should fit well with execs and postplants.

In a relatively big map like this Sova seems like the best choice for an initiator.

Pairing Harbor with another dome smoker is kind of ballsy but I think it can be done on Abyss, Astra can make up for the lack of defense, and Omen can too a little, but also add an extra layer of entry since there isn't a Duelist. Viper of course synergizes with Harbor well already, and also adds defense that the comp somewhat lacks.

Finally, I think double Inititator will be pretty strong on this map - execs will be common and there's a lot of angles to clear, particularly on B. Gekko facilitates plants well and his Dizzy is excellent info. KAYO is great for execs and has lots of util to stall - same with Breach. If I had to guess I'd say KAYO/Breach works better with Omen, and Gekko works better with Viper/Astra, with the former being slightly more exec-leaning, and the latter being more post-plant-leaning.

Example roles: 100T
Chamber - Cryo
Harbor - bang
Sova - eeiu
Astra - Boostio
Gekko - Asuna

GenG:
Chamber - Meteor
Harbor - Munchkin
Sova - Lakia
Omen - Karon
KAY/O - t3xture

NRG:
Chamber - Victor
Harbor - s0m
Sova - crashies
Omen - Ethan
Breach - FNS

FNC:
Chamber - Derke
Harbor - Boaster
Sova - Chronicle
Viper - Alfajer
Gekko - Leo

Thoughts?

this would lowkey be really interesting. see how ppl like chet, elmapuddy, etc., actually control their team.

d3ffo?

Breeze could be Jinggg Reyna maybe

F0rsaken: Cypher
d4v41: Viper
Mindfreak: Sova
something: Jett

He's also played kayo in the past, idk if thatd work as well

s0m in most maps is probs gonna play smokes but can he play jett if vic plays kayo and ethan plays omen?

or is it better to keep vic jett, s0m omen, ethan kayo?

wtf does anyone know what happened?

jinboong is the new suygetsu

me

100% this, the writing is impeccable and Liu's ideas are so well thought out. Definitely worth a read

damn

my childhood