| Flag: | France |
| Registered: | December 21, 2022 |
| Last post: | August 11, 2025 at 2:58 PM |
| Posts: | 4486 |
I agree, one of my personnal wet dream is just to rework sentinel into another role and go on a 2-2-2 rolequeue (Since sentinel used to take 2 lanes with trap and bot, it's ok to go to 6v6)
Sentinel are especially bad for soloQ because it's hard to antistrat things like some trap you cant destroy if you dont have the proper comp
Thanks for your constructive reply ! Disagreement is the best to make the knowledge of Valorant advance. And I advice people to counterargument <3 I definitely more people that argue that she is a Sentinel because I need to finally take a decision and stop creating 4 class just for her
« You mention in the video that she doesn't provide intel. »
Thats true, but that’s not the only thing I mention in the video. The first point I use is the definition on sentinels by Riot and I compare it to the definition of controller, and I come to the conclusion that the definition of Controller fit a little bit more to her than the definition of Senitnels.
In fact my points are :
Now the question is more : Can you name few reasons why I should consider her as a sentinel (The argument need to be specific to sentinel and to not work for controller, and to also fit to tradictionnal controllers), and I think this could be the turning point.
It's allowed to have a male team and a GC team in same structure in T1, no reason why it woudl'nt be the case in T2
They are a new rule If GCKC win Ascention they will be allowed to play in T1 and having GCKC vs KC, so I wont be shocked if it's the same for T2
If you already saw one of my video you can see when i do 1talk about "archetypes" (For exemple 2 init, 2 ctrl, 1 duel, is an archetype, 1 sent, 1 ctrl, 1 duel, 2 init is another archetype), I don't count Sage as a Sentinel, and I create 4 brand new archetype just for her....
Today I wanted to explain why did I took that decision :
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xVLVKI-rQ58
The video is kinda important, one day I will have to take a choice, between count her as a Sentinel, alone, as a Controller, or even as a initiator, and I kinda hope the argument you can bring to me can help me to take a decision about all of that.
Script coming soon
Wait... What do you mean é.è
I come to see Arcane 1 with a lot of hopes, because I'm a huge nerd of lore lol (and even made some video about it in french)
I didn't like Arcane 1 for personal taste (Nothing were inconsistent, but it hated the fact we need between half of scene to guess an explanation to link 2 scene, plus Ekko was a living deus ex machina),
I came on Arcane 2 with low expectation, at first I though it was better than the 1, but that was because I put on off my critical thinking, ending it like "I didn't like it but it wasnt that bad", and after I realise so many inconsistency in so many thing, scene happen just because the showrunner want it, no care if it's makes no sense in the scenario, if it's a betrayal of the char logic and consistency. The cherry on the cake, is it kinda destroyed the lore of LoL, and we have absolutely no idea where to put the event of Arcane in the timeline (Some people suspect it to be before the Noxius-Ionia war, and other to be in the current time of event)
I definitely agree with you it's a good retrospective. I think now Cypher can't make unavoidable trap against a composition that isn't able to break spells, he also has loose a lot, so both may suffer a lot from 2024, I still think Deadlock is puretash, and I think Vyze is the only good choice in Sentinel especially because she can help in atk, she can replace the initiator flashor allowing team to have 2ctrl, 1 diver, 1 flasher, 1 1 reveal, that is for me one of the best comp
To be frank, I dont think Cypher an KJ are sane for the game, so it's better if they disapear
Everything is map dependent, but more time pass, more map may become a 2 controller / 0-sentinel comp
I still need few screen to release my video about "Why I doest consider sage Alone, not a sentinel, and maybe put her in controller in the future"
Last time i've checked 0S > 2S > 1S
I didnt use split 3, only split 2 in both T1 and T2
Given the fact TE was the team that used setninel and EDG dont i'm not sure thats the best exemple T.T
Controller have also global util :X (And lot of people start to say that Viper and Astra are "sentinels" wish make no sense but preserve the feeling that a team need to have a sentinel)
For non-listener, here is the script :
Hi vlr, today I want to talk about sentinels, and why I think 2025 might be the future of no-sentinels compositions. And also, why composition with 2 smoker and either 2 initiators or 2 duelist may be the meta for 2025. and I m’ not gonna use the argument « Tejo destroy every sentinels spells » because, using a basic spell to destroy a basic spell is good but not that OP, and I see mush more intresting things to say here.
Alright, so let’s look at the situation of late 2024 and see how the 0 sentinel compositions have made so far. When I look at spells archetypes and take every maps, 0-sentinel composition ended the year with 54 % NonMirror Winrate, wish is a reeally great result, but this result is a little bit biased by the fact Sage did amazingely and I didn’t count her as a Sentinel, and by the fact some type of archetype that doesnt require a sentinel can be a huge troll, like for exemple the 2 initiator 2 duelist composition.
If you want some exemple, they are even map, where no sentinel where meta, Bind was always a no senitnel map and Split have significant good result on doble controller and doble duelist composition. And if you take most recent international event : GenG won the last master being unbeaten on Breeze with 3 win without a sentinel and EDG won last champion being unbeaten on their 2 games of Abyss and their 5 games of Lotus playing no sentinels on both map.
So no… You can’t say « 0 sentinel composition arent viable », they where already quite good bfore Tejo’s release, and they may be even stronger after.
So let’s just look at the class archetype and target at the 2 archetype that I think have the most potential : 2 controller archetypes with either double duelist or double intitator composition. If you except the 4 archetype with Sage, you can see that, globally this 2 archetypes are the 2 best one. Doble initiator composition have 55 % Non Mirror Winrate and in second position we have doble duelist composition with 52 %, but this one is far to be significant.
So we ended the year with composition without Sentinel being already good. But after the year end, few thing happened, first Vyze was release, wish is good for composition with a sentinel, because, she is a sentinel and I still think she is a hidden broken pick. Then we got a cople of up and nerf, Cypher was hardely nerf, wish is obvisouly bad for the Sentinel pickrate… Neon was also nerf, and since Cypher is a counter of Neon, her nerf also is an indirect nerf of Cypher, then Astra was up, and Astra is a good alternative of picking a senitinel… And Finally Tejo was release.
And Tejo is hard countering the last meta sentinel : Killjoy… Why ? Because you remember when I said using a basic spell to break a basic spell isnt that op ? Well when it’s a refillable basic spell can break an ultimate so easily then… Yeah, now we can call this OP… Also, keep in mind, that Killjoy ultimate is the main quality of Killjoy, and I dont really think she have maps where she is played without having a gamebreaker ultimate. So since they are no draft in Valorant, picking Killjoy knowing the opponent team might pick Tejo and nullify your impact doesnt seems a good choice.
So let’s look at every sentinel, and see who is strong, who is weak and who you should pick, one by on :
So we are potentially in a situation where a complete class of agent is bad, and since we are not forced to pick a sentinel in a composition, because they are no rolelock, and some of thoose composition are good. THEN… Real question… Shouldn’t we consider to stop playing Sentinels ? Some team did it in the past and it worked really nice !
So I can’t wait for next year. Will Killjoy and Cypher still be the best option after Cypher nerf, Neon Nerf, Tejo’s release, Vyze’s release, Sage up, Astra up ? I’m not really sure of that, and I really hope some team try to drop thoose 2, and try new thing, it can be pick Vyze, pick Sage, or fully commit on no sentinel on new map, and maybe this is even the best solution. Anyway byyye.
I really hate the format, it so easy to fuck it with a bad schedule, and you know I could rank full day about this, they are other format that are far better to me
Ready to switch for a CN flair ?
Not talking about master, talking about regular season ^^
APAC flag, EMEA name, living in AMER this is a little disturbing @.@
Do you think it would be doable to hold VCT Americas in Los Angeles with all the problem LA have ?
Is that even possible to held it in USA with all the VISA problem team might face in the future ?
What potential US city would you call to replace Los Angeles ?
What potential country would you call to replace USA is visa problem become too big ?
Thats a problem for monocountry T2, but vast majority of T2 have more than one country. In France and Brasil, we have enough big org to make a full sustainable T2 because people are already connected to team thanks to influencers the key to make T2 fun, is to create T3.
Take a region with barely no strong identity like Polaris, that end up with a lot of mix, create one T3 region for each region that cost almost nothing, give the top 2 winner a slot in promotion with the top Premier team, doing that, you augment the number of T2 team that represent a small nation.
Second exemple, SEA, now they have all merge, they should all have their T3 region, and have a full system that ensure every T3 region got at least one representant in the T2 (one solution to make it work here : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0_fOPBPWl_w)
If everyone is represented in SEA megaregion, then we will have mush more hype in the T2
And the solution to make T3/national league that will bring state representation in T2 work for almost everyone :
And if some region lack of national rivalries, then we can change how the T2 region are made... TR region lack of hype ? Just add Greece (And ensure at list one or two Greek team is add), viewership will literally double
You did forget TH and FUT, they font loose a map for the next 2 day and I haf I can predict I see no reason why thoose 2 shouldnt count :c
As a French, I watched VIT vs KC with a lot of hope, thinking both team could be good. And god ! This one was an horrible Abyss, KC have such a superior composition, but they were never able to take space(When they did they instantely loosing it just beacause they leve), the basic concept of "deposit" was inexistant, they're always ending to make a 4 man push on a stacked site, it was absolutely insane, 0 strategic depth,... they managed to take a lot of thoose round but that was so bad. FNC was absolutely horrible (No guys, you can't play 0 reveal composition since S3, this is a thing of the past, especialy when you have OP agent as Tejo), and no BBL isnt good. Maybe TH and FUT will save us.
To be fair I just think this year everyone is "bad", everyone try to figure out what is really the new meta, and is kinda bad at it, but also kinda bad at executing those new comp. The region that will figure out first (and manage to master it) will win most event this year. In S3, america's team where the first to trust Chamber, and they absolutely dominated the internationals tournament. I think we might be in the same situation.
My guess is that 2 ctrl, 1duel, 1 reveal, 1 flash will be the optimal meta (Like last year champ) : like I said in that vid https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrMksWF43n8
And the team that will figure out first will have an advantage
Oh boy I just have a PTSD remembering the situation in League
I dont get why it would be fair to give that type of advantage to a looseing team x)
Team hasnt figure out what is great yet, Tejo and Vyze reshuffle things a lot, and team arent used to do something new.
Not sure it will stand, I just feel people experiment but and the end of the year we will end on thinking X is OP and we will need new agent to reshuffle things
WTF does FNC/KC play today and TL/TH play in 5 days ???
The looser of TL and TH games will be fucked, they will have 2 day to prepare while their opponent have 7 day
We kinda go back to thins video when you have some situation when loosing give you an unfair advantage : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Jvn-sRsuZTE
Basically half is deadlock, quarter is Iso, quarter is Harbor.
Anyway, ASent stay top 3 of no flashor maps ^^
What ? Ascent is the most stale meta we hs ever saw...
While people glaze the 2 sentinel composition that have been played at the start of the kickoff, data of last year seems to show that no-sentinel composition (Modulo Vyze) are really great , and may even be the future of Valorant
And here is why : https://youtu.be/nrMksWF43n8
I think Cypher nerf and Killjoy should in long term go down when the inertia will be over; Riot might have kill the 2 most viable sentinel, and even if I think Vyze is OP in proplay because she perfectly fit the meta, we may see more and more composition where the sentinel has been replace by a controller. (And I think it's a good thing)
I didn't talk about it yet in the video, but I believe the future of Valorant is 2-controller composition, with a Duelist, an Reveal, and the last spot for the 3 other roles. because it allow you to take mush more risk.
What is your point of view ?
Ascent is the most defense favor map, and the 3rd map in term of non-flasher in Pickrate 7%, 56% NMWR
Best exemple is Jett/Sage/Sova/Kjoy/Vipr
Was the meta comp for a long time
She wasn't nerfed on preseason so no reason to believe her strengh in the last split have changed. You don't judge a pick on 3 maps ^^ (especially since the top team hanst played yet since they arrive in round 2)
Only reason I can justify people pick her less it's because pick her less and less in soloQ and doesn't know to play well enough for proplay, but she was strong after her nerf so no reason to beleive she is weak now (Especially with Tejo that can counter KJ ult that was countering Viper ult)
Yup, I did question myself a lot about putting Gekko in vision, but since team use him a lot like that, I decided to consider him as a vision (Played in 1011 games as solovision, played in 589 games as a solo vision T1 + T2 combined in Split 2 only)
No worry it was already the case before Neon up.
Name one specific reason why no flash are good on Lotus and Icebox (Literally the 2 most different map in the mapool) and it couldnt be sucessfull in other map ? Except Breeze the Winrate of this composition are in positive in every single map.
Data on 2024 Split 2 (T1+T2) : 0-flash composition représent 14% of compositions, (55% Non Mirror Winrate)
Pickrate by mat
On the last master only
Composition without a flash are also good.
3 initiator is an horrible composition, if you remove your sentinel it's fgor a smoker (And 2 smoker comp are strong)
Sentinel are weak as fuck in the current meta, when the best team gonna play people gonna copy them, we ended the year about 0 sentinel being meta en Bind, Breeze, Abyss and fucking Lotus. Every sentinel where nerf and now we have 2 senitnel meta ? This makes no sense, this new mode gonna stay for like 2 mounth and split 1 we gonna see less and less senitnels (Even more when Tejo will be mastered)
I'm kinda sure that the gameplan is to have a better aim than their opponent here...
I dont get why they dont go full Russian, when you commit on a subregion you will got a fanbase even if you are low tier (Same for BBL, going Inter is bad)
The 2 worst map of the game come back x)
I like the fact map rotates a lot, with recent Breese change I only they are only 2 bad map, and rotate a lot allow to be bore less but also avoid pro have enough time to figure out what is the best comp is avoiding stale meta.
One of my concern is that I dont like the fact the meta change between a split and a master and that may happen with how the schedule is sort out. (Plus keep a mapool for 2 mounth might be not enough if thats THAT volatile)
More I think about it and more i want only 4 act per year (With a lot of change :
Using a Rifle against Iso make Operator usable in the same round ?
I really doubt KC is a boring team, 2023 was peak entertainement
Iso is the peak of what Riot did worst in the game, the agent is both weak and horrible to play against in same time, no agent should be able to remove a single weapon from the game.
Best solution I see is "Delaying the damage he receive after 10 second", (like Clove), meaning if he get shot by an operator, he will die after 10 second, and maybe manage to take some space. So Operator will not feel completely Useless and Iso sheild will not be totally useless (plus it may make heal a little bit stronger because in some situation Iso will die if no heal, giving a small up to Skye and Sage that really need it)
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