Yeah maybe they could pull an envy and comeback lol, but really any big sea org could fill that slot (unfortunately motiv and naos are very new very small orgs and unlikely to be part of t1 other than through ascension)

I mean this is why riot hates falcons/saudi, prob the reason they wont get a team in emea for a bit

Nah splitting emea into 2 was already on the edge for me, and for reasons I mentioned 50 times before I am pretty against it, so splitting it into 3 would just be way too crazy imo and make no sense at all

I mean yeah ideally oce gets a slot, but I've mentioned this earlier in the thread the achievements/teams/talent of oce just isnt there yet compared to th/mysg/indo, and so it makes more sense to invest in those before oce, but I do hope oce can get a proper org and players and actually look competitive

and yes SA should include all of latam, but I do think some distinctly Na latam countries like mexico should be non import in both regions

literally one of the larger orgs in brazil and they are doing very well in br t2, why should i take them out

Talent dilution increases the more regions exist.

Yes that is a valid point at first but if you look at the growth rate of china compared to every other region, it quickly disproves this argument. Kr is already oversaturating pacific with talent, and anyways the amount of their teams stays the same. Jp has plenty of domestic and t2 talent, already some of which are dominating t1, and the teams/viewership would only get better and better in t1 if they were given 2 more slots. Sa has a similar problem, except due to how americas works, sa teams have less time and resources to actually develop talent and try to build winning sa rosters.

More rosters than ever would be completely infeasible under import rules.

Most rosters (like >90%) will stay the same. The only rosters in this situation that would really change would be lev (which is good bc they would actually field a good sa roster instead of just signing na's scraps) and ge (they would have to unsign 2 of ban, udo, or kristal, which already looks likely after this season given how bad they are)

Building a viable team becomes especially hard in countries with a lack of domestic talent. Countries with highly promising players get screwed over since their talent has less room in region to shine, especially with the proposed 8 teams per region.

??? Splitting Sa from Na gives more Sa teams more opportunities to sign more Sa players, who are already proven to be top class. 8 teams per region for 6 regions is also the same amount of teams we have now, so it's not like theres going to be any less talent, its just going to be redistributed.

The eight team per region design makes for a pathetic league system. Masters 1 is already universally considered Mickey Mouse for the pathetically small size of the tournament. Viewers already complain about the lack of matches to watch in valorant and this won’t help that on the regional level. Yes, this can be mitigated with bigger internationals like you implemented. However, regional viewership is still important. International tournaments don’t fit everyone’s time zones, but your regional games always will. Fan engagement for bad teams is healthy for a sustainable esports ecosystem, and if all the viewership is concentrated at the top level, the bottom will rot.

People get fatigued with what we have now, and it's not like I'm cutting any games. If anything, look at my proposed schedule and you'll see that I gave multiple options for how league play could work depending on how many matches riot wanted to run in the regular season. Less teams per region doesnt mean less games, in fact it means the same amount if not more games plus more flexible time zones bc more regions. Also 8 is like a perfect number for brackets, and nobody would complain that a regular season trophy is mickey, since nobody cares about them rn anyways.

Champions stage is not viable. This would drag out champions to an unsustainably long timescale. Champions takes nearly a month already. Adding a round robin would put this past any reasonable timescale. Viewership for group stage will suffer. The only option would be to either run games together on two streams or run BO1s at the cost of making all the games at the event feel cheaper. Venue will be downgraded, probably with no live crowd.

Thats why I specified that champs is no longer just a tournament, it's a different entity. Again, this isn't a perfect solution, but riot could draw up way more hype in separating champs from masters and making it seem much larger by building it up more, and this would allow also for the actual playoffs stage (what people care about) to be way grander and pull in way more viewership.

China will dominate. The largest country in the world with the largest playerbase, vs regions that were smaller before but now even smaller, with talent diluted across them instead of concentrated. They can scrim every team in Asia, snag players with monster salaries, and maintain the largest talent pool while every other region breaks up.

Nothing is changing for them. If anything they will be at best equal to other regions, since emea will be more competitive as well, and regions that are already good such as kr and na getting their own regions would give them more teams/resources/talent to actually be more globally competitive. Other than that, china is the same man

The saadhak affect, he was the only one that had a chance of beating them when it mattered, and he did. twice. in the same tournament. missing 2 world champions.

I did include xolos

ok but the scene has mainly only grown for the better since franchising, the scene is much more stable, people watch a lot more regions/games that they normally wouldn't have, money is coming in much more, the scale is much grander, each region is much more consistent, etc.

yes next question

I mean 8 sa teams that can quickly sign talent, plus no other region would sign more than a few at most sa players, that sounds good to me man. If at worst they never improve (even though its highly likely they would, look at chinese valorant glow up after they got their own region) then in my proposed system they would send less teams to masters 2, still have presence internationally but not clog up spots

I mean this just goes to show then imagine if they had their own region, they could actually make internationals and be globally competitive

Nobody wants faze back bro 😭😭

optic lite is here, maybe if they win ascension quick lil merger action return of optic????

Lev was more of an na team, and how far did kru go?

Also regionally almost all of na consistently beats almost all of sa

you can always be better lol

whats your solution wise guy

One thing I wanted to keep across all regions was team numbers. Giving more developed regions more teams only keeps them ahead, while less developed regions fall behind. And its not even like japan or brazil are nearly as bad as their t1 performances, some of the best players in the regions are from br and jp, its just that due to either having less slots, geographical issues, or other reasons, it doesn't make sense for them to continue fielding national rosters and developing local talent.

I'm down

Don't hold americas in US, find a more VISA friendly country (Maybe mexico?)

Riot is based in LA. Unfortunately it doesn't make sense for them to spend the money and resources relocating, and for them its easier/cheaper to just let Sa falter.

look at pre partnership JP and KR teams, KR VS/DRX was heavily stagnant, JP and KR benefit from different playstyle of SEA fast paced aggressive aim.

Sea players and teams are not inherently more aggressive, and kr players and teams are not inherently more stagnant. In an 8 team East asian region I guarantee we would see a variety of playstyles, players, and teams.

dividing NA and SA would make that worse, seeing SA teams beat NA teams would cause more interest to watch.

this is not a counterpoint, just your opinion. Me personally I would rather see a flourishing Sa scene that was globally competitive rather than one that just keeps getting curbstomped by na and filling the bottom slots

less EMEA teams in the league (12 to 8) will cause top teams in EMEA to be more dominant, Partnership era causes EMEA to decline due to many competition, the mid table are causing the different representation for each internationals. Top EMEA teams would prefer less teams to be more consistent and keep it winning form instead of fluctuations.

Literally I countered this exact sentiment like 5 times in this thread, I'm not gonna explain it again but there is more than enough of an argument against this. Look at #3

Overall the SA visa issues mainly with americas hosted in non visa friendly country to those less developed, even bren said in platchat to consider change location for VCT Americas. Leo Faria said ascension can't be hold in US cause BR teams would need 7 months on VISA application.

Look at the top of this comment

This year in specific many casters/analyst does say Pacific recent dominance is due to having many different playstyle, and it all stems from APAC aggressiveness, KR utility macro, diff comps and the benefit of scrim CN teams in the region. Splitting Asia would reverse the effects of those benefits in which sent Asia back to pre partnership era.

Look at the second reply in this comment (asia is also SO much more developed in the valorant scene than pre partnership, we don't have to worry about them reversing back lol)

EMEA is weird cause only turkey got integrated to EMEA, no CIS (unfortunate) and MENA region org. Tier 2 is a mess but the top EMEA org benefit heavily and benefit by being more consistent due to less teams. Having stacked EMEA teams (12) will create different representative at internationals, which is why EMEA was better pre partnership instead of partnership era.

We currently do have 12 teams, where is the representation? Riot doesnt like saudi or russia, and anyways those regions get dominated in t2. Plus there are plenty of cis players in t1. Reverting to pre partnership is also not good for many regions again I mentioned earlier in the thread.

that issue with US being a non visa friendly to countries who aren't "first world countries" . A more concentrated South America specific league would just turn into Japan, won't be great internationally unless a LOUD superteam was formed. Venue relocation is better solution. South American teams scrimming NA teams is better for development like pacific and CN.

Literally again countered this point multiple times. Simply, these teams would have much more regional talent, wouldn't have to worry about other more dominant regions like kr or na, and they could still scrim with plenty of other good teams. For example, china was by far the most underdeveloped region by a significant margin, but giving them a condensed 12 team league allowed us to see other teams like wolves and te to flourish on the international stage

Like yes ideally this is a good solution, but two major problems arise for me

1. This would make it so now there are 7 regions, which is terrible for planning (anything odd number is hard, plus 7 is prime so its even worse) and there is no clear 8th region that would make sense to add (I initially thought of OCE, but look through this thread and see why it wouldnt make sense at all)

2. Teams like Metizport, Dnsty, enterprise, and navi all are equally intertwined with emea. Splitting them up for the sake of splitting them up doesnt make any sense, as youre just barring so many players and teams that would previously play with eachother

In summary, emea is the one region outside of china where subregions are pointless, since other than turkey nobody makes national teams, and everybody just signs good players from any emea country as long as they speak english. The split here is cool in concept, but it doesnt actually help divide the region into a more manageable scale where competition is fair, bc no one subregion in emea dominates rn. This "solution" only really adds more restriction both in the emea scene for players and orgs, but also on riot for deciding how to organize masters/champs with 7 regions

My point is that other than china, emea is the only region where subregions dont really matter. across all 3 french teams, theres like 1 french player, and across all 3 spanish teams, there isnt a single spanish player. every single roster in english international, which is something that neither pacific or americas have. I explain this a lot more in #3 and #16. For the oce representation, yes is it important, but there are literally no big orgs and barely any players in oce, so idk what do do there, #4 thread kinda explains the situation perfectly. Also, Na + Sa have about the same playerbase relative to their population as apac and emea. The difference is that emea fans watch all the matches bc the region is much more homogeneous, whereas americas fans only really watch if a team from their subregion is playing. Plus china gets their own region completely to 1 country so ig its only fair that 2 continents can get their own individual regions as well. For the apac teams, sure you can change it around a bit but I think its only fair plus it makes the most sense to give subregions like Indo/Th/Mysg more teams as long as every other subregion has some representation, bc they have been consistently performing and thats where the actual orgs/money is.

franchising gives more intensives for teams to invest in rosters bc it offers stability, viewership, and more fiscal opportunity for orgs while also keeping the scene much more manageable and operable for riot. plus a franchised league looks a lot better and way more professional than a non franchised league

JP is cucked in pacific bc they have only two slots, and giving them any more would just cuck everyone else. JP teams in my scenario would also benefit from competing with more jp teams and also kr teams.
Top sea teams will benefit, bc there is more regional talent, and therefore teams can more quickly progress into being top teams instead of just being destroyed by korean teams like they are now
Dividing sea and ea will allow both regions to have more slots, develop more talent, offer more viewership, cut off korea from just dominating sea, bring more jp t2 fans/teams/talent into t1, and help develop struggling sub regions
Idk what youre talking about with your china point or how it relates at all to what im arguing
how does centralizing pacific in kr benefit everyone?? korea clearly dominates pacific and outside of prx no other pacific team has had or is having any global presence

mb wording is weird, but in my proposed solution they wouldnt

SA is literally so held back because brazilian teams cant sign talent mid season and cant sign talent late in the offseason

Jp valorant will actually have a chance to grow both in terms of skill and viewership, and jp t2 is huge in japan, and some of the best talent from pac comes from jp t2

Na viewers already barely watch sa vs sa games, and they would anyways pull in more sa viewership bc of timezone differences plus more recognition, and east asia will have a huge influx of jp t2 fans bc there will be an actual t1 presence

Asia timezone issues can be solved by only having 1-2 asian regions playing per day, and the others playing on off days

Cn got a massive buff after no longer being associated with pacific/being a weird subregion

Emea will become the same the only thing is the bottom feeding players/teams will die, Na will get better regionally but at the international level really stay the same, the top na teams are already heavily dominant

overall having more specialized regions helps local national and regional talent to develop without one subregion dominating, plus the system of masters 2 only having 2 teams for the 2 worst regions makes it so the worse regions dont just flood internationals. we saw it with china, where the year it became an official region they won champions. brazil, japan, and apac all have the potential to become huge international threats as we have seen in previous tournaments, but they are constantly cucked in their own region due to being held outside their country, having visa issues, teams with shit management, or just not enough representation for the amount of talent that they have. Emea will not dominate, as most of the teams are the same, and they all basically comm in english (check #3 and #16 for more in depth, not explaining this again)

but most russian players live in/are from the euro part of russia, making russia combine with china wouldnt add any russian orgs, plus it would be a huge inconvenience for the russian players. Plus there arent any russian orgs rn anyways, and most russians prefer to play/have played for emea teams since forever

When do the "Best OAT/Top X OAT" posts end bro...

I'm tired boss

the meta is talking in agent select before picking an agent and asking how everyone is doing etc and all to get the vibes. If people respond positively and all then its generally good (80% success rate method) but if people start telling you that youre being annoying or they start telling you to shut up its not worth the risk

helps me a lot, plus if others on the team hear a toxic crybaby then they are also more likely to dodge

you were so close man

rumour has it babybay payed g2 to play

I'm a liquid fan through and through but this is just straight up retarded man. 2023 demon1 would make miracles happen

Gambit vs Crazy Racoon

all for self positivity and all but this seems so forced and corny lol like if anything this is just giving self mental help a worse look

seems more like a game than anything

I mean yeah it definitely is, hopefully a pacific org can pick up another oce player or by a miracle an oce team/a team with a few oce players ascend so people can recognize the scene and its problems kinda like when dos9 and sultan were trying out for t1 and people realized that riot doesnt give a shit about central asia

yeah I mean what are the chances that Leo Faria lurks vlr lol maybe it could happen fingers crossed

Thank you bro I appreciate it. Most people on this site just clown anything lol.

Yeah in terms of emea I had the initial idea of adding a region which would be like central asia, turkey, middle east, east europe, and north africa, but the issue was that there were not enough teams to fill the slots and make it globally competitive, and even if orgs invested then there would be 7 regions which is a really ugly number, and there wasn't really an 8th region I could add (I initially thought about oce, but there isn't nearly enough presence in val)

also bc of how hard it is to field sa talent compared to na talent we are seeing teams like loud, lev, and mibr slowly switch over to having more international, english speaking rosters

had a few stinkers but when he looked good he looked good, especially for such an offrole/playstyle

oml people clowned me so much for saying eg wouldnt be wrong for keeping him especially letting potter develop him as a player

guy basically invented lurking and anchoring
invented lurking and anchoring

be fr

trexx could never (my cold hearted goat is too nonchalant)

I bet this would be really cool and funny if I knew what it meant

Real ones know that apoth has insane potential on senti

finally someone who gets it man

dog what are you trying to say

some real 100t tdawgg mental right here

genuine most psychopath post on this website giving gamergirl a run for their money

gym people come

ong jennifer lopez goes crazy with a bench pr

Girl C

this reads like a themaniel post