Why does Game Changers exist in the first place?

#1

ad3n

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Hello all,

I am being very genuine and I hope I get a genuine answer.

Why does Game Changers for marginalized gender exist in the first place?

I know women’s leagues exist in many sports, mainly because of the physical differences between men and women. In other mental games like chess, the major tournaments are open for both genders because those physical differences are not relevant. However, we can consider women are weaker than men in Chess due to not so many women compete in chess.

If there are no inherent mental differences between men and women, I understand why women have a separate league because the level of female players is lower and that is mainly because far fewer women play FPS games just like in chess. However, why are players from marginalized genders expected to compete in women’s leagues rather than open leagues, especially when some were assigned male at birth and may have had greater exposure to FPS games? In other words, what do marginalized gender players even need a separate league if they don't struggle of lack of exposure to FPS games as cisgender women do?

Thank you for your attention, and if I get banned o7.

#2

Livvie

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Have you noticed a difference in how trans women are treated by this community and how cis men are treated

#3

owoboy

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I think their point is that trans women grew up with a bigger exposure to gaming and fps games specifically due to being male at birth, therefore their situation isn't as comparable to female pro players (i think, also not trying to speak for myself or ad3n)

#4

Livvie

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Yea sure but theres still a difference between trans women’s growing up around video games and mens growing up

#14

ad3n

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They both grow up as men

#5

ad3n

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Being treated badly should not justify having your separate league

#6

Livvie

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Ngl im too tired for this rn but

Its there for a reason. Maybe someone else can answer you properly

#7

Castawaytwizz

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I agree with this argument (and it's why they have the league in the first place) but it then makes me wonder why some of the male presenting nonbinary players are allowed to compete tbh. Look at SRG, one of their players is a ~6ft (born male -> nonbinary) with a typically male haircut, a square jaw, and a deep voice. If they chose to compete in the main circuit I question the level of discrimination they would face tbh, but maybe its not worth drawing the line at x level of transitioning

#8

HamSandwich1001

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Game Changers is not a women's league, its a league for women and other marginalized genders. I think the points you bring up may be valid regarding trans women and exposure to FPS, but for whatever reason, we have only ever had one openly queer player in T1. So Riot still feels that its important to have a spot where queer pro players are given a spot where they are given a strong place to compete.

I'm not trans so this is kinda just full speculation, but imagine if there was a trans player with the same level of skill as someone like Aspas playing in tier 1. Recently, a lot of people have ben clowning on him for being a semi baiter and for MIBR not being as good as they should. But Aspas will never be hated for WHO he is. A queer player (or a female player) won't have that luxury, and that would def be a factor keeping queer players from trying to go pro.

#9

Livvie

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This is the person this is the words yea

Thanks

#10

ad3n

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if there was a trans player with the same level of skill as someone like Aspas playing in tier 1.

If that's true that would be great and that would be thanks to them being exposed to FPS since they were a kid, as opposite to cis gender women which proves my point. So why would they go and bother women in their league? Wouldn't that similar of smurfing which is illegal? Why you don't care about women and them performing in a weak level? If they can't play with men so create their own third league for some reason because they are not eligible to the reason women's league exist in the first place.

#11

HamSandwich1001

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I feel like you're oversimplifying things.

not all pros played FPS games since they were a kid.
a lot of female pros did
Game Changers isn't a women's league
Smurfing isn't illegal??
my point about a hypothetical trans player was to mention that they will almost always receive more hate compared to a cis pro of similar skill/playstyle, and that would make playing in tier 1 less appealing.
I also do think there are other barriers to entry (like harassment ingame) when playing online games as a queer kid, even if they aren't as bad as what women have to deal with . having constant light harassment from vc in comp games isn't exclusive to women.

#12

ad3n

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Not all pros played FPS games, of course but the game is dominant by men because men are more exposed to videogames, PCs and other sports than women. Nothing is wrong with that.
I know GC is not a women's league, but it's mainly women except this year we have seen dominance from other genders. One day it will be all marginalized gender players and cis women players won't be able to compete (not because of any inherit mental differences but because marginalized gender players are more exposed and more likely to play fps games).
Smurfing is indeed tolerated by Riot.
Harassments should not be a justification for creating specialized leagues. A kid being queer is already a problem that I won't get involved in right now.

#15

HamSandwich1001

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you're 100% right, there isn't anything inherently wrong with men generally being more into FPS games from a young age than women, and therefore being a majority of the pro scene. But its not like only 1% of players are women. over 30% of val players are women. Obv that doesn't mean 30% of pro players should be women, but is it not strange that not even 1 is? A lot of women don't play FPS as a kid, but for the millions that do, what do you think is keeping them from getting into T1? You said it yourself that its not a mental or physical difference, so something about the pro scene is just not appealing to women.
I think this is a good thing to bring up, but I think we might be coming at this for opposite sides. I will say tho that the number of queer players in GC have not been goin up by that much (they've always been about 40-50% of GC).
Yeah we are not gonna agree but a vlr forum is not the place to have a debate on trans people lol.

At the end of the day, VCT and GC are products for riot to make money, and even if GC loses money (and VCT) Riot prob has evidence that shows that hiving VCT and GC makes more people play val.

#16

alpha91r

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"debate on trans people", I just wanted to feel okay in my own body :(

#17

HamSandwich1001

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mb could of worded that better. its like have a "civil debate" on if Canadian people have a right to exist.

#18

ad3n

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vlr forum is not the place to have a debate on trans people lol.

It's okay for them to create their own genders and join women's leagues to ruin their lives but we are not allowed to debate them forever as they are from heaven or something.

#19

HamSandwich1001

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brother what

#13

SerialMemester

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brotato chip....